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Author Topic: Water pump to block mounting bolts  (Read 3131 times)
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mangocrazy
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Graham Stewart


« on: May 31, 2023, 08:08:31 PM »

Bit of an odd one, this. I'm currently cleaning up the water pump that was briefly fitted to my Spider 2000 engine before its untimely demise and I could have sworn that the 4 bolts that hold the water pump body to the block were M8 size. But when I look more closely at the water pump body, all of the mounting holes are between 6.5 and 7.5mm. This leads me to think that the pump is held to the block by 4 x M6 bolts. Is this the case?

Thanks in advance.
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mangocrazy
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Graham Stewart


« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2023, 09:06:20 PM »

Answering my own question - the bolts are indeed M6. The parts book gives the following part numbers for the mounting bolts:

10902621 - Bolt, short (M6 x 25 according to Google) - 2 off
10903421 - Bolt, medium (M6 x 45 according to Google) - 1 off
10903621 - Bolt, long (M6 x 50 according to Google) - 1 off
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1980 Lancia Beta Spider 2000 (S2FL)
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SanRemo78
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« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2023, 09:12:06 PM »

Mark does a stainless steel bolt kit for not many pennies!
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WestonE
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« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2023, 07:39:53 AM »

Remember the copper washers that go next to the pump body at the bolt head end typically with a steel backing washer. These copper washer need to be new because they deform to seal the hole.

Eric
PS I used stainless cap heads and stainless washers with spring washers. Either Copperslip at the block end or omit the spring washers and use the softest locktite.   
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mangocrazy
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Graham Stewart


« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2023, 08:49:16 AM »

I'm intending to use M6 stainless flange bolts and (as Eric suggests) a drop of the 'weak' Loctite. I might also add copper or aluminium crush washers in the cause of belt and braces. It's not a job I want to be repeating any time soon...
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1980 Lancia Beta Spider 2000 (S2FL)
2002 VW Transporter T4
2017 KTM Duke 690R
2008 Aprilia SL1000 Falco
1992 Ducati 888 SP3
1988 Honda VFR750F
1980 Yamaha RD350LC
Neil-yaj396
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« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2023, 09:34:58 AM »

The M6 bolts always seem somewhat small to me for this job. Not the usual Lancia over-engineering....
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mangocrazy
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Graham Stewart


« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2023, 10:07:10 AM »

The M6 bolts always seem somewhat small to me for this job. Not the usual Lancia over-engineering....

Yes, that was my thought as well. I guess that if you had the block on an engine stand you could enlarge the bolt holes to M8, as there's enough meat on the water pump body for the holes to be enlarged to 8mm +. But it's not something I'd think about doing in situ.
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1980 Lancia Beta Spider 2000 (S2FL)
2002 VW Transporter T4
2017 KTM Duke 690R
2008 Aprilia SL1000 Falco
1992 Ducati 888 SP3
1988 Honda VFR750F
1980 Yamaha RD350LC
Nigel
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« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2023, 09:59:23 PM »


Hi,
The only force acting on the pump body is from the v belt, and as it's
a rotational force, plus a bit of tension, it's not particularly high. Provided the bolts, threads,
mounting surfaces and the pulley bearing are all in good condition,
I don't see an issue.
Although the pump may well take larger bolts, the block is already compromised
by the threads, or some of them, entering the water jacket. Enlarging those
may well lead to unintended consequences!


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mangocrazy
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Graham Stewart


« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2023, 12:20:40 AM »


Hi,
The only force acting on the pump body is from the v belt, and as it's
a rotational force, plus a bit of tension, it's not particularly high. Provided the bolts, threads,
mounting surfaces and the pulley bearing are all in good condition,
I don't see an issue.
Although the pump may well take larger bolts, the block is already compromised
by the threads, or some of them, entering the water jacket. Enlarging those
may well lead to unintended consequences!


Yes, you're quite right. I'm sure Lancia sized the bolts adequately. They did use M8 studs on the water pump to back rail flange, so it was clearly a conscious decision to use M6 bolts on the pump to block connection.

Graham
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1980 Lancia Beta Spider 2000 (S2FL)
2002 VW Transporter T4
2017 KTM Duke 690R
2008 Aprilia SL1000 Falco
1992 Ducati 888 SP3
1988 Honda VFR750F
1980 Yamaha RD350LC
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