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News: Meetameeta21 Oxfordshire 27th-29th August
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Author Topic: My 1.6 coupe restoration (formerly back in red + rust)  (Read 3084 times)
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chrisc
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« on: November 23, 2020, 06:03:32 PM »

After about a.. 12 year? has it really been that long? break from Beta ownership after I sold my HPE VX to fund my first house, my new project is due to arrive Wednesday.

Naturally I've bought it via based on some facebook marketplace videos and a shaky video call by a nearby contact with zero car knowledge.








Much more to follow once it arrives.. thank goodness the parts availability has improved since 2008.

Daft question to start with.. this has no keys. To help me out with deciding whether to get a locksmith out to match keys to it, or to replace the entire lock set.. how many keys should it have? 1 for the doors, boot and fuel cap, 1 for the ignition?

« Last Edit: December 29, 2020, 11:46:24 AM by chrisc » Logged

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S2FL Coupe 1600 (restoration project)

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« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2020, 06:55:37 PM »

Hi

Brave man, should keep you out of trouble for a week or two.....

From memory the key code for the doors etc was originally in the glove box, though someone will correct me if I have it wrong. There are refs on the forum to locksmiths who can cut from the supplied code. I had this done for my ignition and door locks. Normally there is one for the doors etc and one for the ignition.

You can see here where I documented setting my locks to the same in case you have a variety which is not uncommon due to PO replacing failed locks with ones from other cars.

https://www.betaboyz.myzen.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=4191.0

Peter
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chrisc
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« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2020, 08:53:30 PM »

And that's the fantastic knowledge and helpfulness I remember of this community. If it's just a case of hunting around the glove box this will be much easier than I thought!
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« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2020, 11:00:44 PM »

The door key code is, or should be, on the back of the glovebox lock itself.
As Peter said, if locks have already been changed, this may not help.
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1984 2.0 Carb HPE [ex Aus] Silver..turning to Grey Finanza.
2007 Mazda 6 2.3 [current daily, highly recommended]
The past:
1980 2.0 HPE White in South Africa [hope it survives!]
1976 1.6 Coupe Lancia Blu [PFG 76R] [probably deceased]
oh,and an Uno Turbo 1997 also in SA [stolen,never recovered]
chrisc
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« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2020, 08:16:25 PM »

It's here!

Better than I expected, but as I bought mostly unseen, I'm now spotting there's a few hard to find bits missing. The poor thing had basically been pressure washed on a wet motorway for a couple of hours to get here, so it was wet inside and out. With the combination of it being pretty dank, and me being supposed to be working I didn't get much of a look today but here's where we are

Where to start?



This is good. Pushing it around is hard work at the moment with the brakes dragging but a set of refurb calipers are on the way to help address that - the first item on a large shopping list.

What's my biggest worry? At the moment it's not the windscreen surround or indeed really anything super obvious - it's the passenger door.
Gap at the front

Gap at the back. it doesn't shut properly, more investigation is required. I can't see it being hidden structural damage.. hopefully it's just as simple as someone's made a hash of refitting the door


What else did we find?

Boot lid has clearly been replaced at some point - champagne silver on the inside Smiley


Front valance has taken a whack


Strut towers have previously had attention but need it again to be a small job now rather than a big job later.


And what to conclude with.. an approach to restoration?


With the structure solid enough to continue with, I think I'll go with getting it running and driving first of all then figure out where to go from there.

Expect me to pop up on here soon looking for help with a shopping list of parts. I had a short look in the glovebox, didn't spot a key code but I didn't look very hard. With the boot lid having been replaced I suspect that's unlikely to match, so I'm leaning towards a complete replacement lock set.

More to follow once I've given it a clean
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« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2020, 10:05:34 PM »

Hi Chris

This also got my attention when I spotted it on Facebook, mainly because it's the closest reg no I've seen to my silver Coupe  Smiley
Do you know if the Chequered Flag (Chiswick) was also the supplying dealer ?
2022 will be the Beta's 50's Anniversary, nice target to aim for  Grin
 
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Tony Harrison - Farnborough, Hants
1981 Beta Coupe 1600
1981 Beta Coupe 2L(being restored)
1997 Fiat Cinquecento Sporting
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« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2020, 05:15:50 PM »

I really would have a good look at the A posts before spending big on parts. They could be the cause of the poor door fit and will have suffered in some way with water ingress via that hole in the scuttle. Not really surprising that it is shipping water.....
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chrisc
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« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2020, 08:56:23 PM »

I've got zero history to go on. there's the remains of a red dealer sticker at the base of the rear window but that's it.

I'm looking forward to giving it a scrub at the weekend and seeing what I've got. In the meantime, chucked a couple of bags of dessicant in there today to supplement the drying out process.

The doors don't droop and there's no unseemly noises tapping down the a-pillars so I'm hopeful it's simple.

Replacement front valance on the way so that's a few hours of panel beating avoided too Smiley
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Current:
S2FL Coupe 1600 (restoration project)

Former Lancias
HPE VX A52 VGK (parts donor)
C363 RPC (probably still sorned in cumbria with it's new owner)
chrisc
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« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2020, 11:28:21 PM »

Amazingly I managed to fail to take any overall pictures today, just detailed ones.

It's really the simplest things I struggle with sometimes! today was actually mostly dominated by one simple problem - how to move a car with properly seized brakes.

I pushed the old girl out of the garage just a tad.. tried pushing it back to make sure I wouldn't need any help, and discovered that whilst I had pushed it out, I couldn't push it back.
I then discovered that my mate who I had prepared for just such an eventuality had been offered some short notice building work and was unavailable, and the wife was.. unwilling to volunteer.

On a nicer day I would have jacked it up and taken the brakes off, but it was bloody miserable outside today, so once I'd given it a scrub and a hoover I grabbed the battery from my alfa, disconnected the coil lead and drove her back in on the starter. Or at least I tried - the starter got me most of the way but couldn't hack the combination of the garage lip for the front wheels and the seized brakes. Being a gambler I hooked up the coil lead, took a deep breath and turned the key.

For a car running on 23 year old petrol she runs absolutely lovely and even in the few seconds taken to reverse her in the garage she's got a noticeably different character from the VX's I've had in the past - much more zingy.

So what did I actually do whilst it was out of the garage.

I gave it a clean, vacuum and filled in my little inspection sheet



I also found the key code where you'd said it would be, which is excellent.

Tony - this is all that was left of the dealer sticker at the base of the rear window


Lets get the bad bits out of the way before I get onto the good bits. This isn't all the rust but it's the bits that I'll focus on for today.
The passenger side door is drooping after all, hence the poor alignment.

I'm not sure if this grot alone is sufficient to be responsible for that - but it's not going to help.


I also had a look at what the situation at the base of the o/s front wing where we suspected there'd be more rot - yup


Noticed some flaky paint in the boot drain channel above the rear light. That turned out to be particularly yucky.


And really the largest single area - below the rear window turned out to be more extensive than I'd thought - basically that whole lower edge is frilly



Possibly also a small amount of grot on the front crossmember but I'll get a look at that when I take the valance off.

Now, before the doomsayers come out... Lets get onto some good.
  • The front wings need nothing but normal panel prep + painting
  • The rear quarters need nothing but normal panel prep + painting
  • The doors I think will get by with just the smallest amount of attention to the interior bottom edge where the panels fold over
  • The bonnet interior and top lip are both better than they looked
  • The boot lid needs nothing but normal panel prep + painting
  • The sills are good
  • The glass is all good
  • The floor pans are good - I poked at some flaky underseal and it peeled away to reveal the unmarked factory red paint!
  • It starts, runs and drives!





Next stop online shopping. Hopefully most of it will be simple but i'll mention the bits I think will be trickier so if anyone knows a supplier for the following shout
  • Headlamps + bezels
  • Lancia key blanks
  • Boot badges (beta + 1600)
  • Stainless trim for the boot lid

Thankfully the expansion of Beta Boyz means a lot of the stuff that would have been a nightmare is now relatively simple, not least all those repair panels!





« Last Edit: November 28, 2020, 11:30:26 PM by chrisc » Logged

Current:
S2FL Coupe 1600 (restoration project)

Former Lancias
HPE VX A52 VGK (parts donor)
C363 RPC (probably still sorned in cumbria with it's new owner)
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« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2020, 12:14:50 AM »

Hi

The rot looks typical unfortunately, time/money and effort required.

These guys will sort you keys out from the code

JOHN RICHARD SECURITY PRODUCTS (WIRRAL) LIMITED    
202A PENSBY ROAD
HESWALL
WIRRAL
CH60 7RJ

TEL 0151 342 2318 / 4074
info@locksnkeys.co.uk

There are others as well.

Peter
« Last Edit: November 29, 2020, 12:16:29 AM by peteracs » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2020, 12:18:42 AM »

I may have some boot trim in my stock of coupe parts as well as the odd spare badge, though the badges may not be up to much, I will check.

On headlights what do you need exactly, bowls and carriers etc?

Peter
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chrisc
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« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2020, 05:09:03 PM »

I've been quietly collecting parts (and will be for a while yet), but a nice milestone arrived today in the shape of a set of keys, so kudos once again to John Richards Security Products. I've been lucky - the keys cut from the factory code fit everything bar the fuel cap, which I suspect is seized rather than the lock being wrong. Better than I'd expected with the boot lid at least being non-original.

I've been eyeing up the halogen headlight replacements which have been previously discussed on here and reckon I'm going to give that a punt as well - I have a mix - siem on one side and carello on the other, but from the back they all look identical. I suspect the carello ones are the originals.

I've also managed to pick up a pair of folding recaro seats from a mk3 golf for cheap in decent condition. dimensions wise it looks like they should be a goer, so my intent there is to retrim them in a more period material. Not quite the lovely VX recaros but what I hope will be a nice upgrade.

Anyone know how Mark is getting on? not sure whether or not now is a bad time for a parts order Smiley

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« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2020, 07:13:24 PM »

Hi Chris
Good news on getting the keys cut  Smiley
Mark popped round the other day for a cuppa and chat, his parts sales is still up and running.
He's working a lot of evening shifts lately, but will more than welcome your order.

Cheers
Tony
 
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Tony Harrison - Farnborough, Hants
1981 Beta Coupe 1600
1981 Beta Coupe 2L(being restored)
1997 Fiat Cinquecento Sporting
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chrisc
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« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2020, 05:35:45 PM »

Balancing out the equation of paying someone else to do stuff and getting it done faster versus doing it myself at the moment.

First indicative cost back from a company today based off seeing photos of the car.. I'd asked them if this was something they'd take on - have a look at the photos, if it passes that, have a look at it in person and then provide a rough guess.

Nope, straight in based off the photos with a big wedge at what I would guess they have estimated as a 600+ hour project. Try as I might I can't see 600 hours of work in this car! ah well on to the next place!
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Current:
S2FL Coupe 1600 (restoration project)

Former Lancias
HPE VX A52 VGK (parts donor)
C363 RPC (probably still sorned in cumbria with it's new owner)
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« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2020, 07:07:40 PM »

Hi Chris

The problem you will get I would imagine is that they will add a big slug of time for the unexpected. The more you can show exactly what it is to be done, the more chance you have of getting a sensible price.

Peter
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chrisc
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« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2020, 08:18:58 PM »

Hi Chris

The problem you will get I would imagine is that they will add a big slug of time for the unexpected. The more you can show exactly what it is to be done, the more chance you have of getting a sensible price.

Peter

Indeed that's what the conversation I'd been hoping to have was - just this place wasn't on the same page, preferring to just throw out the risk loaded cost without even having a look / understanding the mitigation.

I see a lot of this at work, but I mainly deal with civil service areas and perhaps had lulled myself into a rose-tinted view of the private sector where everyone is competent and diligent and wants to help Smiley
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« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2020, 09:31:19 PM »

It is very easy to rack up the hours and hence the cost. The bodywork guys I used were not expensive and charged me by the hour with an end result of around 7k in work inc a complete respray and a whole lot of bodywork fabrication. Even then there were areas they did not touch which ideally you would have liked to look at even though it looks ok as a finished result. I was happy with work and the costs which seemed reasonable given the hours they put into it, but depending on your view it was a lot more than the car was going to be worth at the time. So far costs are around 11k which is still more than the car will be worth, but for me that was never the point.

Peter
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« Reply #17 on: December 16, 2020, 09:32:11 PM »

Do not forget to email me with what trim etc you are after.

Peter
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« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2020, 03:45:00 PM »

Hi Chris

I emailed you re the trim, can you get back to me if you still want them?

Peter
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« Reply #19 on: December 20, 2020, 09:13:32 PM »

Er...   G...... ULP.

Have fun!
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1979 Beta 1600 Coupe

1962 Lancia Appia Series 3 Berlina
1973 Fiat 124 Sport Coupe 1800
1975 Lancia 2000 HF Coupe
1977 Princess 2200 HL
1981 Lotus Eclat Series 2 (project FOR SALE)
1982 Moto Guzzi V50 Monza
1982 Moto Morini 350 Sport
1983 Land Rover Series 3 88
2009 Jaguar XK 5.0
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