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Author Topic: different spring size and springseat sizes for front suspension left and right?  (Read 381 times)
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sleurhut
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« on: June 14, 2024, 09:05:55 PM »

Hello everybody,

I got a Beta 2000 spider 1981 model year. I did a full resto on it about 6 years ago. the suspension was in OK shape, we reused the front and back strut. I never liked the stance it had, it just never looked right. The front was up a bit to much and the backend a bit low, a few weeks ago a big trafficbump the left rear strut plunjer through the mounting rubber. Letting the left side lean heavily. It was time for some new suspension.



Because a full set of shocks is hard to come by here i opted for a good used set from a early car with on the rear replaceable inners.



It are replacement sachs shocks, the rubber in the topmount say 1978 and 79. dampening is good, did a bit of painting on them,



But when i wanted to reassemble them, i found out the front struts are different. One of them has a spring that is a bit higher,



and the topmount/springseat is also different


The difference is 1cm.

on one side a plastic/composit springseat ring is used under the rubber seat, it is exactly 1cm.



other side does not.



The combination that was used was: The short spring was used WITH the 1cm extra composit ring, and with the short topmount springseat. Both shocks are exactly the same length fully extended.

Does somebody know if this is correct? why is this done? And if i mount them, which side is the passenger and which is the driver side?

Thanks!
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rossocorsa
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« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2024, 09:55:54 AM »

This is not correct, the assembly should be the same on either side. I'll try to elaborate later
« Last Edit: June 15, 2024, 09:58:59 AM by rossocorsa » Logged
rossocorsa
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« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2024, 06:38:35 PM »

Please see details on attached link

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/5TYG8qEAUD9sTVEmz7gyKAWE2vrKoDhYFjMZfClsxh4


It is fairly self explanatory, berlinas have a different mount (item 16 on both pictures) to coupe/spider/hpe (front) coupe/spider rear. There should be rubber insulators top and bottom of the spring. The very thick one that fits at the top of the rear springs is usually in good condition but it has a pressed mild steel support (item 3) that corrodes badly and is often in a poor state or completely missing. The thinner rubber rings that fit at the bottom of the rear springs and top and bottom of the front springs tend to perish and even if not perished do distort with age and use, they are a much better fit if replaced with new ones but are difficult to find as new old stock. Note that front and rear spring diameters differ so these rubbers are different front vs back. Shock absorbers on coupe/spider/hpe are a different size at the front to berlina and a different size at the rear coupe/spider vs berlina/hpe.

Hopefully this is useful and I haven't made any mistakes! I think you will need to renew your springs and mounting hardware to sort this out. At the front inspect and grease the needle bearings for the thrust plate (item 17)
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peteracs
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Peter Stokes


« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2024, 10:11:13 PM »

Hi Alan

This is what I knew for the Non Berlina, but does that mean one of the front struts in this case is from a Berlina given the spring is shorter and has a 1cm spacer, normally only seen on the rears? (Albeit different diameter)

Peter
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Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600
rossocorsa
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« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2024, 09:30:22 AM »

I suspect it's a mix of coupe and berlina parts but I'm not that familiar with how berlina parts look in comparison
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SanRemo78
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« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2024, 09:40:37 AM »

And I'll bet Coupe/Spider have different spring rates. Best to get a full matching set?

Guy
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peteracs
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Peter Stokes


« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2024, 10:35:55 AM »

Hi Guy

I would be surprised given the Spider front is a Coupe and essentially the same weight give or take.

If you need a matching set of springs, I have a pair.

Peter
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Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600
rossocorsa
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« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2024, 11:41:33 AM »

And I'll bet Coupe/Spider have different spring rates. Best to get a full matching set?

Guy

I'll check but I think spider and coupe were the same
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SanRemo78
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« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2024, 01:35:23 PM »

My bad! Should post crap when I'm just awake! But get a matched pair on it!
Guy
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Hawk HF3000 - Square Arch Stratos Replica - owned since 1988.
Alfa Romeo 159 T1 2.4 Q4 Sportwagon - Believed one of 4 in UK.
Fiat Panda 100HP and now!
A Lancia Beta Coupe 1981 2 Litre
sleurhut
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« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2024, 03:31:29 PM »

Thanks all for the replies,

Now its clear to me my doubt were correct and this is not a original setup. My original set is still on the car, i can reuse the springseats and springs itself. The rear springs are correct for a spider/coupe and will be used.

I will have to use my old bearings anyways, one of them was cracked on the 'new' set.

Is there maybe someone that has a set of betaboyz springs for sale? Wanted a set for a few years but they were never available when i looked them up.

Does someone know what color code is used on spider/coupe front springs? Blue or yellow?
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peteracs
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Peter Stokes


« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2024, 05:39:51 PM »

Hi

I have a set of lowered rear springs for Coupe. No idea if they are from Mark, if there is a way to tell I can take a look at them? They are painted red and came off a Coupe.

BTW I checked the parts book and there are two springs listed for the Spider/Coupe one is the normal one and the second is for a specific part of the world, suspect where very rough roads.

Peter
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Beta Spyder S2 pre F/L 1600
Beta HPE S2 pre F/L 1600
sleurhut
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« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2024, 09:34:11 PM »

Dont know how to see if they are from Mark. I need a set of 4, front and rear. But thanks ! I will try to fit everything next saturday, was planning to start today but the weather was not too great. Also have to replace the stub axle on the left side. I found out after replacing the wheelbearing there still was a very small amount of play. The machined part of the stub axle had a very minimal amount of play/loose in the carrier itself. Never ever seen something like this before.
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sleurhut
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« Reply #12 on: July 07, 2024, 11:48:55 PM »

Just to follow up on this, i did mount everything the last weeks. Mounted the fronts yesterday, after fitting the rears the car still had its front end to high up. almost 40cm from the edge of the wheelarch to the middle of the wheel. To fix this i used my original springs that where on the car, it needed to drop 6cm to match the rears and get her level. I cut one full coil of the spring and heated the end up to bend it like the original, to maintain the flat underside for the spring seat. I know this is a controversial way to do this because it can harden the spring, but the end is a 'dead' coil that only sits on the rubber. The area was heated just enough and cooled very slowly, i feel confident enough it will last. Finally she sits right, we did a big drive today and it handles a lot better, no more boaty/woolie steering.


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