Lancia Beta Berlina

[Riku]

Hello everyone! I've been a forum member for a number of years as I've longed to own a Beta Coupé. Why am I introducing myself only now? Well, it's because I'm excited to say I've been offered a Beta Berlina, and I would like to gauge the opinion of the people who know the most about these cars.

My question is - how problematic does the rust look to your eyes? I know it will cost me a fair bit to get this back on the road, and I'd like to get an idea of how much additional trouble (expense) the rust could cause.

https://youtu.be/Cbjhj80MxV0

It's not very easy to see, but at the end of the video I point out a couple of spots above the windscreen, the current owner tells me they were touched in many years ago by a previous owner. The car is in a very narrow space, so I apologise for the shoddy camera work!

[Nigel]

Hi Riku,

From what I could see, and it was difficult as you say, most of
it is just flaking surface stuff. Windscreen surround is a standard rust spot.
Generally, it looks ok. I would guess it's a 1300 or 1600 judging by the steel wheels.
Both good engines, especially the 1600. 1300 a bit underpowered, ok for steady cruising.
Yes, to get it back to running and driving will consume money. But if it's been
under cover for years, it will probably have faired better than otherwise.

There are plenty folk on here, spread all around the country, who would be glad assist you
in making a wise decision. Share the location and someone will be localish to inspect with you.

Good luck.
Nigel

[Riku]

Thank you Nigel!

Really good of you to write such a detailed reply. It's a actually a 2000, and I'm in Lincolnshire. Another quick question - one of the camshaft pulleys looks like new, while the other has surface rust. Would I need to remove that rust/replace the pulley? And can that be done without messing up the timing? There a little oil leak close by too.

All the best.

[WestonE]

Hi

The Oil leak will be from the cam cover gaskets having gone hard and the cast iron cam wheel will clean up with use. However you must invest in changing the cam belt and tensioner along with the normal changes of engine and gearbox oil and coolant system flush and refill with fresh anti-freeze. If it was me I would change the oil and filter twice (to clean the engine internals) once I had done a compression test.

Also of course condition of HT Leads Rotor Distributor cap and spark plugs. In other words routine servicing

Eric 

[peteracs]

Hi

The pulleys are different the black one is plastic coated with a shoulder, the other is the all metal one hence looking different. Not a problem.

Looks like a later Berlin’s in good condition from the closeups.

Peter

[Riku]

Thank you Eric for your advice. I'll be sure to order new gaskets and cam belt. It looks like I would have to buy a bearing for the existing tensioner, right? From searching the forum 3205-A-2RS1TN9/MT33 seems to be the correct part. Do you think it's necessary to drop the fuel tank and check for internal rust before running the engine, or is that overkill?

Peter, thank you. That's very reassuring to know! All the best.

[peteracs]

Hi

On the tensioner bearing before you order check if the one on the engine is replaceable. Some aftermarket are not and you need to replace the whole pulley which can be more challenging to find. If you need to do this I would try to find an original replaceable bearing one.

Peter

[WestonE]

Yes Cleaning out the tank is a VERY good idea as soo many Betas kill their fuel pumps after a long lay up.

Eric

[Riku]

Hi everyone, thanks for your replies. After quite a bit of elbow grease, I've managed to get the engine to turn by hand. It was so hard I nearly gave up! The belts look good enough to hook up a battery and try turning it on the starter before I go any further. Can anyone more mechanically minded than myself suggest a simple way to stop fuel flowing when I do this? Getting the fuel tank dropped and cleaned will be a priority job if I decide to proceed. I've put two videos on Instagram of yesterday's efforts: https://www.instagram.com/lanciabetaberlina

Peter, is this a replaceable bearing tensioner? 

[Nigel]

Hi Riku,
Don't try turning the engine with the starter. You could easily break the belt
with instant catastrophic failure.
Remove the spark plugs and squirt some engine oil into the cylinders first. Let
that soak for a few days. In the meantime, drain the oil, remove the cam belt
and tensioner pulley. Yes, looks like that's the replaceable one. There'll be a number on it.
Drain and flush the cooling system. Check the water pump. Confirm all water routes are clear.
 On my car I found
solid crud blocking the lower steel water rail. Zero flow.

I spent many weeks recommissioning my 2.0 engine that had sat for 14 years before I
finally got it running. It was a slow, methodical process.
There are many helpful hints all over this forum to assist you.

Good luck!
Nigel

[Riku]

Thank you Nigel. I've pulled the trigger and bought the car. I shall follow your advice to the letter!

[peteracs]

Hi

Where in Lincolnshire are you?

Peter

[Riku]

Hi Peter. I'm in sunny Lincoln.

Question: can the rear water rail be removed (and reinstalled...) with the engine in situ?

[peteracs]

Hi

Not too far from you then, I am between Grantham and Sleaford, maybe a visit to see you would be on the cards as not that many local to me that I know?

As to rear water rail, I removed mine with it in situ, however not sure if I needed to take off the top steady bar to help.

Peter

[Riku]

Hi Peter! Back again. Yes, that would be good to do sometime, thanks. So, I'm hoping to get a few jobs done this Easter. Do you know if the Quinton Hazell Timing Belt Tensioner, Part number: QTT149 is a fit for the Beta saloon? It's also sold as part of a kit with the code QBK446. Autodoc and other sites say it is a fit, but I can't find any info on the forums from anyone who has tried them. Likewise the Optimal Waterpump AQ-1301.

I'm looking to buy these as they can be delivered in time for Easter.

All the best.

[peteracs]

Hi

Looking at their spec they look to be good for your engine (2000), but not bought that particular part nos in the past as have original housing to replace bearing. Water pump again looks to be correct if photo is of part etc. Nice thing about Autodoc and others is you can return for credit easily. Does not help if you allocate time of course….

Peter

[Riku]

So I've been travelling all over the place this Easter, and today was my first opportunity to spend any time on the car. I've got her up on jack stands for the first time, with the intention of doing an oil change. It was a bit annoying to find the drain plug is a hex bolt, and I don't have a large enough Allen key to remove it. I thought I had an extensive collection of Allen keys, but I have been proved wrong. Sad times. A search of the forum suggests I need a 12mm.

Also, it appears the gearbox oil is leaking, hopefully just from the drain plug. Does anyone know if the drain plug size is the same for both gearbox and engine oil? It looks like they don't have gaskets, but if anyone knows of anything that fits, that would be great.

This is the first time I've been able to inspect the underside of the engine bay, and I've included a video for your viewing pleasure. I took the opportunity in this video to have a look at the rear water rail too. Doesn't seem as bad condition as the top water rail, fingers crossed.

https://youtu.be/pLdvI0oKFb4

[peteracs]

Hi

Part of my socket set bought from Ebay had various hex Allen keys including the ones for the drain plugs on the engine and gearbox. Still available widely on Ebay for around £35 and I would not be without it.

As to sizes, the gearbox has the same size and the diff is one size smaller (10mm?).

If you want a link to an example of the socket set let me know…

Peter

[WestonE]

Your gearbox oil leak could be the speedo drive missing O Rings as it is above that area.

You need to clean it all then run it to hot and watch for exactly where the leak is from.

Eric

[Riku]

Thank you everyone!

https://youtu.be/PfALEBebwaM

I'm hoping to attend the LMC event on Sunday, maybe see some of you there.