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Author Topic: Lancia Beta HPE 2.0 IE Track Car Blog  (Read 94171 times)
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lanciamad
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Marcus Robinson


« Reply #20 on: November 04, 2009, 03:34:16 PM »

Not much to report... this postal strike seems to be slowing me down with various pipe/hose for the relocation of the filter in the post from fleebay. I did have a look at the butterfly, and the throttle cable needed a bit of adjustment as it wouldn't fully open without a bit of force on the pedal.
Quote
It does seem to be quite slug-ish from low revs though
that was probably the reason. Wink
A job that wasn't important but has annoyed me for a while was this:

90% of what you see was purely down to the screw underneath the grill rusting and then the water running down and staining the valance.
Quick rub down, primer and spray and looking presentable again Smiley
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1988 - Lancia Delta HF Turbo - Sorn - http://www.lanciasport.com/forum/index.php?topic=2585.0
1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
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« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2009, 02:40:52 PM »

Managed to have a go at relocating the filter with various items arriving in the post, so its gone from this:

To this now:

It does fit quite snuggly just under the black brace bar which is a bonus, but i'd like to get a better angle and fit where the new sections fits the original hose.
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
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rossocorsa
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« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2009, 04:20:23 PM »

if you are aiming for track use could you not fit main/dip/side outer lights then use the vacant inner bowl as a grille with a tube shaped enclosure behind it to fit the cone I'm thinking n/s would be best as it would have a shorter hose run maybe you could use the o/s for an oil cooler?? 
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« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2009, 05:13:38 PM »

Oil cooler sounds good to me Wink over the O/S would make sense being so close to the oil filter as well, although according to the gauge it never reads past half way in the green, i'm sure it would benefit from one though. Do the monecarlo's have an oil cooler fitted just out of interest, and I presume a sandwich plate is required for the extra two hoses Huh?
My future plan is to relocate the battery inside the car, so as you say the air filter can go in the n/s inner wing which has a cold air feed from the gap in the front valance. I'd just need a 180 degree pipe from the air flow, or chop the "elephant trunk" hose so that the air flow meter was straight in line and a 90 degree hose down to the filter.
Funnily enough the car has perfect weight distribution with me in the car, side to side. Any suggestions where the battery would be best Huh? Boot, behind passenger seat maybe Huh? Negative ground from battery should be alright connected to the chassis as long as its substantial shouldn't it Huh?
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rossocorsa
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« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2009, 06:40:28 PM »

volumex has oil cooler and larger radiator same as air con versions of normal beta
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« Reply #25 on: November 16, 2009, 08:37:58 PM »

Update time Grin
After a good day out at the NEC classic car show on saturday, I also bought some more things for the car, suprise suprise Roll Eyes as well as a few unexpected items i'll be testing out  Lips Sealed (Watch this space)
This is what I bought; a pair of rear polyurethane strut top mounts:

Due to the piston rod type of the spax units, the round file came out so there fit:

Quick sand down (Already shot blasted) then primered:

Only spray can with enough paint in it was gold, so here's a front and rear shot:

And strut put back together again:

Comparison shots for you, before and after:

Quick bounce up and down in the car, and there visibly stiffer but by no means rock solid, another successful project by Mark Wink
More from me tomorrow i expect Tongue
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1988 - Lancia Delta HF Turbo - Sorn - http://www.lanciasport.com/forum/index.php?topic=2585.0
1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
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« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2009, 08:50:27 PM »

Quote
More from me tomorrow i expect
There is....
New territory for me today, never had a look nor worked on the gear linkage inside the car, to find there's not much to it Cheesy Plastic centre console removed (less weight again) and gear knob.

Nut and bolt removed underneath:

Unit removed:

This revealed the sound proofing etc... which i removed and chipped away (More weight loss), just a bit of surface rust revealed:

Quick rub down with a sand block then primered:

Sprayed up in gloss black:

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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
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« Reply #27 on: November 17, 2009, 09:05:56 PM »

I then sanded the floor down ready for painting:

and primered:

Primer to Aluminio code, 620:

Drivers side done:

Passenger side primered and sprayed:

If I have some time tomorrow, it'll be relocation of the electric window switches, refit modified centre console piece and refit standard gear linkage, for now Roll Eyes
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
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« Reply #28 on: November 19, 2009, 07:40:07 PM »

Had a go at relocating the electric window switches over the last couple of days. Luckily i had a spare metal plate for the fog light switches, so i cut the ends to get rid of the holes and trimmed the bottom a bit, so the switches will fit nicely in the perfect sized cut outs originally for fog light switches.
I mated both together then MIG welded (Neat enough for something you won't see Cheesy) them together, pic. of the front and sprayed up:

Dummy fit to see what it would look like:

Refitted the gear linkage:

Centre console got a further chopping, refitted and all wires connected:

ECU fitted correctly Huh? Previously was just wedged on the back piece of the console which no longer exists, but found the correct bracket now, also wiring tidied up:

Mats cleaned and fitted, job done Smiley
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
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« Reply #29 on: November 20, 2009, 05:22:53 PM »

Everybody likes stickers Smiley well you've got to be childish sometimes:

Just need some betaboyz's one's now Wink
I thought i'd better take some more pics. so i know what i'm looking for in the garage when I get around to building the uprated engine Cheesy
Head Gasket Set:

Head I expect to be using as it has already had some work done to it:

I don't know what car it has actually come from so if anyone knows Huh? that would be great. Due to the amount of work already done to it i expect i'll use it over the, head on the car now, the head that was on the car before the head gasket went, oh and the 131 head in the garage. Roll Eyes Only problem with it is this:

Is this critical Huh? I'm hoping its just something for you to locate the head onto the block easier, i cant remember Undecided
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« Reply #30 on: November 20, 2009, 05:35:28 PM »

The camshafts i'll be using are the very scarce Fiat Strada 130 items, which i managed to track down eventually and not too bad a price, and £70 off the advertised price wasn't bad either, i want to keep the standard distributor/igntion setup for now, so these were my only option as Guy Croft doesn't sell any for the IE, and his prices are not an option for me anyway:

Valve Springs i'll be using are made by a company called Iskenderian, and i've been told that they will cover me upto an impressive 9,000 rpm Shocked:

For valves, i've bought some oversize stainless valves which are 41.5mm intake and 37mm exhaust, but looking in the haynes manual it says the 2 litre has an intake of 41.6-42mm Huh? So i'll have to check that when i build the head. I've been told, "These can run in your head with the stock seats cut out for the valve diameter and still leaves a proper minimum between the contact face and the edge of the seat." so shouldn't be too much of a problem:
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
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« Reply #31 on: November 21, 2009, 10:28:48 AM »

I have a pair of 130tc for my vx you'll have to do a 'how to' on changing the cams over so that I'll know what I'm doing later Wink 
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« Reply #32 on: November 24, 2009, 03:32:00 PM »

When I get around to doing it, will do. Wink Got to stop working on the car and projects first then i'm sure i'll lock myself in the shed one day and it'll be done, hopefully Smiley
Well its been a whole 4 days since I updated Shocked Cheesy (I have way too much time on my hands atm) so here's the latest.
When at the NEC, some items i wasn't expecting was presented to me by Mark, these included, some new "prototypes" for me to try out. The first is a new gearbox shock, the second the engine shock and thirdly a short shift gearchange kit. The gearbox shock I took away with me, the engine shock still needs some adjustment so that'll be one for the future and the short shift gearchange kit just needed some final details, you may have seen it at the NEC on the saturday Huh?
This is the gearbox shock:

And fitted:

When I took the original off, it was a bit of suprise to find it was effectively doing nothing other than acting as a pivot as there was no compression what so ever, i presume there should be at least some. In comparison this is rock solid, but the car feels no different to drive on the road and i've done 100 miles already with it. The "testing" will be this saturday when its put through a whole days work out on Castle Combe at a track day. Hopefully it'll help through the chicanes, and i'll take it apart to see if any wear has occurred.
Last weekend i popped down to Mark's to pick up the short shift gear linkage which is now completed; we fitted it there but due to the awful weather, didn't bother getting it adjusted properly. It was fine, but finding 5th and reverse was a bit of a nightmare. This i'm pretty sure is down to the rest of the linkage having the original bushes which are worn. (New bushes on the shopping list)
As a temporary measure I have sorted the linkage now so all the gears can be found, as I will explain in a min. (I'm not going to be able to chase after the magical 119 mph without 5th!)
Here's the new bit:

Notice that the stem is now straight to further reduce the movement for 2nd and 4th, and Mark tells me there is also less movement for 1st, 3rd and 5th as well, regarding this.
Effectively the movement has been reduced by changing the pivot point; a spacer has been added and of course if the gear lever moves up, so does the point at which the bearing carrier attaches, see pics:

Sprayed gold:

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1988 - Lancia Delta HF Turbo - Sorn - http://www.lanciasport.com/forum/index.php?topic=2585.0
1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
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« Reply #33 on: November 24, 2009, 03:32:39 PM »

Fitting; remove the nut nearest the handbrake and loosen the two nuts bulkhead end, this will allow you to pivot it enough:

Now you have access to where it attaches to the linkage, remove the nut, then remove the bolt. (The bolt is threaded into the linkage as well as held by the nut)

Remove the 2 x 10mm bolts holding the bearing carrier down and the whole unit will lift out.
Place aluminium spacer on the unit, due to the length of bolt required now, you will need to get some longer one's as the originals are too short, Mark supplied me with these allen head type bolts:

Tighten hub carrier down:

This leaves you with the linkage to connect up, washer you see pictured behind head of the bolt is unnecessary but when fitting the linkage don't forget to put the really thin washer in between the block and the linkage; I tightened the bolt first then refitted the nut but there's nothing stopping you from doing both at the same time:

As I was having an issue with getting 5th and reverse, I found that by packing a few washers under the point it mounts near the bulkhead on the passenger side it pivotted it enough so i can get all gears now due to the poor condition of the linkage bushes. 5th and 3rd were so close it took the easier route all the time into 3rd; anyway, i put it into 5th gear, then tightened the nut nearest the handbrake then the two near the bulkhead:

Job done Smiley Just awaiting my "racing Cheesy" gear knob now.

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1982 - Lancia Beta HPE 2000ie - Track - http://www.betaboyz.myzen.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=472.0
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
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« Reply #34 on: November 24, 2009, 07:31:06 PM »

With regard to the suspension, adjustable camber front and rear is something which would be ideal. General setup for the road to save the tyres and a more aggresive negative camber set up for the track, so i'm going to be trying out a few things Grin
The rear transverse arms are currently, one solid and one adjustable as original. My idea is to have two adjustable arms so that not only toe can be adjusted but also however much or little camber you may require.
So i've come up with this:

Essentially it is a threaded piece of mild steel tube with a wall thickness of 2mm. At one end it has a left handed thread and the other a right handed thread. This means that when on the car, no parts or bolts will need removal and the tube can be adjusted while on the car for the aquired suspension setup. To attach this tube to the car, is done with the use of rod ends/rose joints, which simply thread into the tube and are locked in place with a half nut.
When fitted I will use the spacers shown below, (2 for each rose joint) as well as a Nylon spacer which should keep the rod and rose joint far enough away from the strut body and rear cross member.

Pictured below you can see the top arm wound fully in either end giving a "hole to hole" measurement of 550mm which is very similar to the original setup while the arm below is wound out so that there is enough of the rose joint threaded into the tube, but still gives a "hole to hole" measurement of 580mm, which hopefully should be more than enough; even to satisfy me Cheesy.

With regard to the front setup, I have some new bolts and eccentric bushes coming in the post, then it'll be down to how i'm going to fit them, and what level of camber they can produce; i'm sure i'll keep you all updated! Grin
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
2005 - Subaru Forester XT STI - Road
thecolonel
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« Reply #35 on: November 24, 2009, 07:32:41 PM »

Sorry, but I don't see how raising the gear lever base would effect the pivot point.
surely the pivot point is the same only higher.
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« Reply #36 on: November 24, 2009, 09:21:33 PM »

Maybe so Geoff; sorry my mistake. The actual point which the linkage meets the rod is the same, I suppose it is due to the extended length of the rod, less movement is therefore needed to operate the gears. Mark would be able to confirm.
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1988 - Lancia Delta HF Turbo - Sorn - http://www.lanciasport.com/forum/index.php?topic=2585.0
1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
2005 - Subaru Forester XT STI - Road
thecolonel
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« Reply #37 on: November 24, 2009, 10:42:36 PM »

I took a not too dissimilar route with the Gamma (I cut two inches off the top)
much less travel and more precise, although saying that if you miss a gear it
can be more difficult trying to engage it a second time.

Geoff
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« Reply #38 on: November 27, 2009, 01:01:32 AM »

New gear knob, from this:

to this:

Eccentric bushes came today, so had a quick go at fitting them to some spare front strut bodies, needed to enlarge the hole to 16mm diameter but initial signs look good Smiley


Concentration is now on sorting the car out for the track day this saturday, just needs a fluids/pressure check, then brim her with fuel which should just about be enough for the day. Weather doesn't look promising but if its dry then i'm quietly confident i'll be able to keep up with some more modern equipment I'm aiming for a 1:35 min lap round combe (in the dry), only because it would match the slowest car running in the castle combe saloon championship  Cheesy and a standard powered 27 year old car matching that, would make me Grin to say the least. "apparently" I have 4 or 5 seconds to take off my laptime so it may have to wait till next year, when all the suspension changes have been added.
As ever i'll post up how I got on, some pics. and fingers crossed some decent in car footage  Smiley
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1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
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« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2009, 11:37:46 AM »

Well Iíve got some pics. and video footage from camp corner, but no in car footage iím afraid, Castle Combeís policy, suction type camera mounts arenít allowed; quite right really.
Unfortunately it wasnít a trouble free day today :'(, but I still returned home under my own steam in a normal fashion, and happy with the cars overall effort; more on that later.
To start, what glorious weather we had yesterday morning. Rain! Sad Just what you want, I think not. The day would be split by sessions of various driver skill level. I always go for the novice group on the basis itís not the fastest car in the world, but iím not the slowest driver (Well I like to think I am), I had 4 sessions, 20mins each. From around 2ish it would then become open pit lane so all can mix and ďplayĒ. I was going to fit the track tyres when I got there but it was so wet, I thought road tyres were only the way to go; how I was wrong. First thing was the sighting laps, 4 laps at around 50mph to get you used to the track and your car, I was struggling so much I was fighting to keep it on the track never mind behind the pace car. Considering all shocks were on fully soft and I was using road tyres, every corner even though I was doing maybe 30/40mph the back end was stepping out of shape; things didnít look good for the rest of the day Shocked.
As soon as we came back in from the sighting laps, it was time to go out for my first session. Yet again I struggled through the session tail happy at every moment, managing a top speed of around 80mph down the straight, and on about lap 4 of the session under reasonably light braking the nearside rear locked up out of the blue spinning me 360 on the track, luckily with no-one around and plenty of distance away from anything which would damage the car. After completing the session, it was straight on with the track tyres, and what a difference. Even though you wouldnít think it, I had something new for the day, some grip. Smiley
The track was still wet but there was much more grip. The back felt solid now, and it was now only understeer under acceleration, which I was much happier about. The rain stopped and the track started to dry out, this is where we get to the 4th session. As the track dried I was finding more grip and was starting to go quite well; a Porsche 944 and Caterham were no match for the HPE and were overtaken during the session, then hereís the BUT.
As I approached quarry corner (25% of all uk track day accidents happen at this corner!) the engine suddenly died, but managed to slow the car down enough under braking and going through the gears to get round and pull to the side of the track. As I waited to be towed back in, my initial thoughts were, is it a belt, has something let go engine wise, or is it fuel starvation. As soon as I got back to the paddock it seemed ok engine wise and all belts present and correct. As it was reading a quarter of a tank of petrol and the amber light flickered going through the chicanes I thought it was down to this. Held the air flow flap open, built fuel pressure up, turned her over and started first time. I went straight to circuit motors, you got it, right next to the circuit and put £20 of fuel in, job done i thought.
It then went to open pit and the track was almost fully dry, so I stiffened the suspension by 8 turns all round. The car was absolutely flying around thatís all I can say. I still overtook the 944 even though the driver was starting to become half decent and the track was dry, matching it for pace down the straights and much faster than him through the corners. After almost a lap of holding me up, he finally gave way. I say gave way, I mean had a drag race down the main straight to get past him; Italian horses won Grin.
Few laps later, and exactly the same happened again, turned out of the chicane and the engine just died, this time there was well over a half a tank of fuel so that ruled fuel starvation out, and being the same again I was confident it wasnít belts, it wasnít. I had no spark! Exactly what I didnít want, like you do, we fitted a spare coil (2), ignition amplifier and distributor, no luck. Put all the original parts back on, then eventually noticed the yellow wire on the battery terminal wasnít looking brilliant. Forced it into its connector and presto I had a spark! Iím guessing due to the forces being put through when cornering this was disconnecting the wire just enough to cut ignition while still looking as though it was connected. Tightened everything up, put the road wheels back on and drove home without a problem. The first time it happened I can only guess I knocked the wire or battery while playing with the air flow meter.
Generally I was pleased with the car, in the dry it handles superbly, not too differently to an impreza estate! Brakes seemed good for what they are, the quick shift is good, found all the gears with ease, and the gearbox shock seemed to help with cornering through the chicanes, so generally all positives for the day. Only criticism would be when reaching the limiter in 4th, changing to 5th is like hitting a brick wall, where trying to squeeze that last ď19mphĒ is a struggle; I was told the maximum reading was around 108mph on the speedo.
Quotes of the day come from two friends, which were passengers:
Ben, ďIts certainly got some gruntĒ
Mark, ďIt handles and brakes much better than I thought, itís great fun Iím well impressedĒ
Thatís far too much writing Embarrassed, so hereís some picís:


More pics. can be found here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lanciamad/sets/72157622768683859/
and some videoís:
Castle Combe November 2009 Lancia Beta HPE McMillan Support
Lancia Beta HPE Castle Combe November 2009 McMillan Cancer Support Track Day 28/11/09
Castle Combe McMillan Cancer Support Lancia Beta HPE November 2009
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1982 - Lancia Beta HPE 2000ie - Track - http://www.betaboyz.myzen.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=472.0
1988 - Lancia Delta HF Turbo - Sorn - http://www.lanciasport.com/forum/index.php?topic=2585.0
1989 - Lancia Delta 1300 LX - Sorn
1988 - BMW E30 325i - Track
2005 - Subaru Forester XT STI - Road
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