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Author Topic: new member from France, beta HPE VX  (Read 1056 times)
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chris62
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« on: June 19, 2020, 09:53:18 PM »

Hello,

wanted to introduce myself quickly, I am Christophe, 46 yold, I live in the north of France and just baught a beta HPE VX.
it's my first lancia and i'm so happy since i got it today !

the car needs some work, the engine blows oïl through the carburettor and the blower is Noisy. The car is in a good shape, with not so much rust as it was Dinitrol treated during its first years.

here are the first pics I ve got



* photo3.jpg (97.81 KB, 441x251 - viewed 222 times.)

* photo2.jpg (110.3 KB, 410x345 - viewed 216 times.)
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hutch6610
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« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2020, 10:34:14 PM »

Hello Chris, nice looking HPE.

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rossocorsa
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« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2020, 10:37:30 AM »

What exactly is the blower noise? Do not continue to run it life that as these blowers are getting rare.
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Sandro
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« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2020, 01:42:32 PM »

Welcome Chris,

Your HPE looks very nice, I've a similar one (in silver) its Injected though so I can't help with supercharger matters unfortunatley.

Good luck getting it set up nicely you'll find plenty of help on here.

All the Best,

Andrew. 
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1984 Silver 2000i HPE
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MattNoVAT
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« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2020, 02:29:26 PM »

Bienvenue Christophe,

Nice car!  I'm certain you will get lots of help from members with Volumex engines, as some have already said, these Roots superchargers are getting very rare and very expensive to replace - but they can be reconditioned. 

Matt
(Dept 79)
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chris62
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« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2020, 07:08:25 PM »

Thank you for your messages.

I will share my investigation results here.
So far I only took the compressions on each cylinder, and one of them is a bit low. I didn"t fire the engine and don't think I will.
I tried to get in touch with Guy Croft via Facebook one week ago, asking if he could restore the blower for me, but didn't get any answer, so I guess I will have to do it myself, unless one of you knows any other reliable specialist ? any help would be appreciated.
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hutch6610
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« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2020, 01:52:46 AM »

Quote
the engine blows oïl through the carburettor
Check the dipstick is not broken, should look like this
https://live.staticflickr.com/4027/5141041108_d337c57ebc_b.jpg
They have a flexible section made of plastic and the metal piece at the bottom breaks off, sump gets overfilled with oil - result = blowing oil.

Quote
I tried to get in touch with Guy Croft via Facebook one week ago, asking if he could restore the blower for me, but didn't get any answer, so I guess I will have to do it myself, unless one of you knows any other reliable specialist ?
You need a special tool to phase the rotors to fully disassemble/assemble the blower (i have one) so i would not recommend trying it yourself.
Usually the rear bearings go dry as they are packed with grease, they need greasing every so often.
Noise Sound is like a marble being spun around in a bottle. 

Here is Guy Croft building a supercharger - hmm is that 150 ft Lb on the front bearing nuts?
You can see how he packs the rear bearings.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koAgbEm4Fug 

Make sure the front reservoir bottle is filled half way with ZC90.
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rossocorsa
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« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2020, 08:53:25 AM »

If the front end seems ok you can take the rest apart leaving the rotors still in phase hanging from the front. You can then clean everything renew the rear bearings and seals etc.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 11:27:21 AM by rossocorsa » Logged
WestonE
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« Reply #8 on: June 21, 2020, 10:44:20 AM »

The Front Bearings are rare and expensive close tolerance C2 type and you MUST set the rotors in phase with a tool. Normally the oil seals are in terrible condition. With the right tools you can re-build it yourself and Guy Croft is unfortunately fighing terminal illness so he may not want to ake the work frankly. If you can hire the tool from hutch you have a solution.

Only you know if you have engineering skill and decent basic tools.

Eric     
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rossocorsa
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« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2020, 11:45:34 AM »

The Front Bearings are rare and expensive close tolerance C2 type and you MUST set the rotors in phase with a tool. Normally the oil seals are in terrible condition. With the right tools you can re-build it yourself and Guy Croft is unfortunately fighing terminal illness so he may not want to ake the work frankly. If you can hire the tool from hutch you have a solution.

Only you know if you have engineering skill and decent basic tools.

Eric    

I managed to do mine excluding the front bearings quite easily, I think it is the rear bearings that take the most stick, the vents for the scavenger pump get blocked and then things get messy. Also you are supposed to repack the rear bearing grease regularly by taking off the small rear cover but no one in the known universe ever used to bother or was even aware. To remove the rear bearings put the rear cover in the oven at about 100 C for 30 mins and they will drop out, same procedure to refit heat the cover and just drop them in. Additionally there is no way that you can clean the rotors and casing unless it is removed. Obviously the front cover also has to come off, just don't undo the nuts holding the gears etc. you need a means to lock the front pulley whilst undoing or tightening the pulley nut or chaos may ensue and make sure you don't lose the special collar, there is a special tool for it but not impossible to do without. Anyway I have not used mine in anger yet but it turns smoothly, when the engine is back in the car I'll find out....      
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 12:08:14 PM by rossocorsa » Logged
chris62
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« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2020, 01:16:21 PM »

Thanks once again for your answers and advices, I really appreciate ;-)

I removed the carburettor this morning to have a look at the Inside of the blower. I d'ont don't realy see any excessive wear or scrathes, but I found some small particles in the casing. i dont know of what material it is, aluminium or steel I dont know. in these conditions I dont plan to fire the engine, too risky I think.

dipstick is in a good condition. Thank you for the tip.

anyway, if I want to do it right, I think I have to take the engine out of the car and have a complete check, camshafts, valves, bearings, piston rings, valve seals and so on. I also have to put a new timing belt, and compressor belt.

I really don't know these cars, and i was wondering if there is any detailled procedure to take the engine out ? or special tricks to get it done ?
once again, any help would be appreciated gentlemen !
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chris62
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« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2020, 12:43:48 PM »

Hutch you were right !!!

I had a look to the dipstick once again, and it was repaired, but with the oïl I couldn't tell.

I took 1 liter oïl out of the engine, put some grease in the dedicated are of the blower, celaned the pulgs, and fire the engine.

It runs ! and quite well ! I am not used to the typical noise of a blower but I can only hear some kind of worn roller bearing noise, but not so much.

even took the car for a short ride, it pulls quite well, but brakes are not that efficent and shocks are dead.

my 16 year old son did most of the fixing as he wanted to get his hands dirty, just showed him how to proceed.

I still have to replace the timing and compressor belt, but I guess I can do it the engine stil in place.
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Inertia
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« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2020, 07:34:25 PM »

Guy Croft returned to work last month.
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Jon

2001 MR2 Spyder
2017 BMW M235i
2009 MB 350 4Matic Estate
2002 Acura RSX Type S
1999 Porsche 911 Carrera
1977 Lancia Beta Scorpion
Inertia
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« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2020, 09:26:04 PM »

I just read that Guy Croft passed today.  Very sad news for our community.
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Jon

2001 MR2 Spyder
2017 BMW M235i
2009 MB 350 4Matic Estate
2002 Acura RSX Type S
1999 Porsche 911 Carrera
1977 Lancia Beta Scorpion
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« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2020, 06:44:21 PM »

The Front Bearings are rare and expensive close tolerance C2 type and you MUST set the rotors in phase with a tool. Normally the oil seals are in terrible condition. With the right tools you can re-build it yourself and Guy Croft is unfortunately fighing terminal illness so he may not want to ake the work frankly. If you can hire the tool from hutch you have a solution.

Only you know if you have engineering skill and decent basic tools.

Eric     

Eric , I only just read this thread but since observing ‘ THE TOOL ‘ on line have been wondering if the necessary tool could not be easily created with a router used to cut  the correct sized T shape cut out of a piece of say 3/4”/1” MDF . I would be surprised if steel etc is really needed to hold the rotors in exact formation whilst torquing ? I have a couple of spare VXs that I wanted to rebuild once I move into a BIG garage . Being in the maintenance game I can not see the torquing process deforming the MDF ? Matt
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