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News: BetaMeeta20 12th September 2020
http://www.betaboyz.myzen.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=4080.0
 
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Author Topic: Beta Coupe GCRE upgrade  (Read 12658 times)
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betabuoy
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« Reply #80 on: July 03, 2020, 08:29:32 PM »

The engineís going nicely.  Almost 500mls completed and, after an oil change yesterday, itís time to use it a bit more.  

Carbs are still as set by Guy and spluttering a bit at low revs but not worth fussing about just yet; Iíll put another 500mls or so on the engine before getting these set properly.  

The planned shake-down has been essential so far.  A few snags to note:

ē   Lost a subframe mounting bolt Ė replaced.
ē   Eng oil temp gauge not working Ė awaiting replacement gauge.
ē   Fuel gauge not working Ė needs fettling inside the tank.
ē   Spal fan disappointing in the recent hot weather Ė might add an additional small fan to cover more of the radiator surface area.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2020, 09:08:20 PM by betabuoy » Logged

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betabuoy
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« Reply #81 on: July 03, 2020, 08:36:24 PM »

Delighted with the Momo wheel.  I should've bought one years ago!


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1983 Beta Coupe S2
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1925 Austin 7 Chummy
and the mighty... 2007 Panda!
HFStuart
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« Reply #82 on: July 03, 2020, 10:33:39 PM »

SNAP!

Good aren't they?
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WestonE
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« Reply #83 on: July 04, 2020, 08:57:54 AM »

I have a Momo Competition for mine. I just wish I could use it!

Eric
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betabuoy
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« Reply #84 on: July 21, 2020, 04:29:04 PM »

Would I say finished?  I suppose youíre never finished with a Lancia and since I plan to track and climb this in the future thereíll certainly be more prep work to come.
Iíve covered just over 800mls on this GCRE creation and itís magnificent. In this spec, the pull comes from around 2500rpm and with my foot firmly on the floor the revs build rapidly. By 5000rpm itís on the cam and utterly hoofing. Changing from 2nd to 3rd approaching 7500rpm is glorious; in 3rd, Iím already at 5000rpm, the carbs are roaring, the exhaust is howling, and the speed just piles on. This is delightful.


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betabuoy
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« Reply #85 on: August 25, 2020, 07:14:05 PM »

Four weeks on from the first proper testing and there have been a few things to fettle:  

The toe-out of the front wheels has come out a bit to 3mm which feels a lot better.

Next, with the Betaboyz shorter springs, I fitted Betaboyz supplied Spax top-adjustable shock-absorbers on the rear using a mid setting; this has proved too hard... it felt like the car was on the 'stops!  Adjusting them to fully soft has done the trick for now but i'm keen to hear others' views?

The carbs were finally properly jetted by Mark Hardy at AutoMark last week and the difference is significant; the Beta had been a bit of a pig to drive 'discretely' at low revs when moving around town but lots of jets-swapping on the rollers has done the trick.  It's way smoother and the dyno graph proves Guy's forecast of lovely flat(ish) Tq from 2500rpm across to 8000rpm (peaking at around 200Nm at 5200rpm) and a max power of around 180bhp at 7600rpm.  I know the dyno print can be just a bit of reassurance but it was nice to see!

Finally, I'm having a few snags with the OE starter motor.  It was reconditioned before re-fitting, and all the feeding electrics and switching have been checked, but it sometimes struggles to turn the engine... particularly after a few priming pumps on the throttle.  It seems better to just turn the key then give some throttle once the engine's spinning so maybe the higher engine compression is the problem.  Anyhow, I'd really welcome any thoughts before I commit to trying a high tq unit.  


 
« Last Edit: August 25, 2020, 07:58:49 PM by betabuoy » Logged

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mangocrazy
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« Reply #86 on: August 26, 2020, 12:07:33 PM »

The car sounds like an absolute delight. On the starter motor front, I recall Guy waxing lyrical over the high torque/compact starter motor that the US Auto Ricambi guys were selling - he gave it an A1 rating and said he'd never known a starter motor spin a high comp motor over so quickly... Probably not the advice you wanted to hear...

Were the jetting changes required to get the motor running better low down significant, and do you have a note of the changes? My motor (when it's finally complete) will have a considerably more modest power output, but will be using twin DCOE 45s with 36mm chokes.
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betabuoy
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« Reply #87 on: August 26, 2020, 01:08:23 PM »

Hi Graham,

Thanks for your thoughts.  Regarding the starter motor, I think you're right and high torque might be what I need; I'm driving the Beta down to Guy's tomorrow so I'll have a chat with him about options.

The jetting changes were pretty significant yes; in fact, I think virtually everything changed but that's the job of the rolling road experts anyway.  Guy assembled my new (Spanish) 45s with 38 chokes; he then jetted them with F16 emulsion tubes and jets that he knew would get me started but said to expect many changes on the dyno.  That worked but my engine's progression when just moving beyond the slow running jet was quite a problem and there were some comments about differences between original Webers and the Spanish ones.  In the end, there was some additional drilling of the tiny holes in the carb body to improve this area.  I was sceptical but it has really worked.

Chris
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« Reply #88 on: August 26, 2020, 07:58:45 PM »

Hi Chris, thanks for that info. I think that (when the day arrives) I'll need to book my Spider in at the same place you used. They certainly seem to know their stuff. Where are they based? My Webers are Spanish made, as well, so I suspect they will need similar fettling. Drilling out airways is not for the faint-hearted...

Please give Guy my regards when you see him. He certainly seems perkier now than he has done for a while.
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1980 Lancia Beta Spider 2000 (S2FL)
2002 VW Transporter T4
2017 KTM Duke 690R
2008 Aprilia SL1000 Falco
1992 Ducati 888 SP3
1988 Honda VFR750F
1980 Yamaha RD350LC
betabuoy
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« Reply #89 on: August 26, 2020, 08:44:37 PM »

Hi Graham,
I will pass on your regards. 
Automark are based in Stokesley, North Yorkshire. TS9 5PT. http://www.automarkuk.com
Mark seems to love working with Webers; he managed all the re-wiring on my car too so he now knows the Beta pretty well.
Chris
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1983 Beta Coupe S2
1967 Morris Minor Traveller
1925 Austin 7 Chummy
and the mighty... 2007 Panda!
betabuoy
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« Reply #90 on: August 27, 2020, 08:42:09 PM »

Had a great round trip to see Guy at GCRE in Lincoln today; I particularly wanted him to see the completed installation of his engine. 
Down the A1 to get there and a blast over the Yorkshire Moors (in some very heavy rain) to get home.
At his workshop, Guy was in really good spirit and, of course, the visit wouldn't have been complete without his giving my Beta a dutiful thrashing.  He approved!  


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« Last Edit: August 27, 2020, 09:13:49 PM by betabuoy » Logged

1983 Beta Coupe S2
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and the mighty... 2007 Panda!
WestonE
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« Reply #91 on: August 27, 2020, 09:25:31 PM »

Great to see Guy let out of the workshop and driving his work!

On the Starters the WOSP Gear Reduction unit is excellent and now have even more powerful Denso motors. They are based in Aylesbury. Otherwise go over the top with Earthing of the starter and the battery i.e. no thin gauge battery leads and really clean connections including starter to block and block to chasis.

Eric
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betabuoy
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« Reply #92 on: August 28, 2020, 08:01:19 AM »

Thatís great, thanks Eric.  All the wiring is new, clean and well up to the current. 
The new starting regime works most of the time but Ďmostí is not really good enough so Iíve been in touch with Mark W and he can get one through the parts shop... fairly quickly too. 
Your extra reassurance on the WOSP unit is just what I needed.

Chris
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1983 Beta Coupe S2
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and the mighty... 2007 Panda!
HFStuart
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« Reply #93 on: August 28, 2020, 11:01:09 AM »

I was running 10:1 at one point and the starter never felt like or was struggling. Your cam timing might be creating more effective compression but it's a pretty chunky unit.

Stupid question but have you checked the engine to chassis and battery to chassis earth connections and the condition of the cables?
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betabuoy
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« Reply #94 on: August 28, 2020, 11:32:41 AM »

Morning Stuart,
Earthís were renewed with very chunky cabling during the rewire so Iím very confident of their effect. The main change came when the carbs were re-jetted and the timing accurately set.
WOSP starter ordered this morning!

Chris
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1983 Beta Coupe S2
1967 Morris Minor Traveller
1925 Austin 7 Chummy
and the mighty... 2007 Panda!
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