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Author Topic: 2000ie Coupe Starts then dies. Any ideas?  (Read 5491 times)
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Bertp
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« on: May 27, 2016, 11:19:36 AM »

Hi,

Need a little guidance. I have a Lancia Beta Coupe 2000ie which was until very recently starting and running fine. The vehicle has been wax oiled and maintained by one meticulous owner from new and as a result is rust free. It was looking a little grubby in the engine bay due to the wax oil and dirt that has accumulated over the years so I decided to give it a slight clean to expose the shiny paintwork hiding beneath. I disconnected the battery and to get better access to each side removed the strut braces. I also disconnected the coil pack and horn assembly on the left hand side of the engine bay.
After a couple of hours of graft was really pleased with the result and proceeded to connect everything up. When I then went to start the car it fired up and then died straight away and now still continues to do so. I have read similar posts on the forum and can verify that sparks OK, fuel pump is activated when air flow meter play opened, air auxillary valve responding to heat and cold. All I keep thinking about is that I have inadvertently forgot to connect something up or dislodged something but have gone through and checked numerous times to find nothing out of place. It seems like to much of a coincidence not to be something that I have affected.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.     
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gengis
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« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2016, 08:13:35 PM »

The only things that I can think of at the moment is ECU earths,  they come out of the injection loom and connect onto a couple of studs on the cam end plates.  Also check that the AFM multi plug is properly seated.  If you have fuel pump running and sparks then it should run, unless the injectors are not getting fired, hence check ECU earths.  Let us know how you get on.
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1983 - Lancia Beta Coupe
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flex
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« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2016, 09:57:59 PM »

After a while laid up i had a problem where all injectors bar the cold start one were not supply fuel. it would start then die. It hadn't been run for a while and they needed zapping with 12v to free up. If yours had run recently it is possibly a connection somewhere not being right (as explained above) causing the same effect.
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millieman
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« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2016, 01:52:36 AM »

sounds like you have an air leak which could be the main bellows come adrift from airflow meter.
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Bertp
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« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2016, 04:14:09 PM »

Thanks for all the replies. Have checked the earth connections and for any leaks and all seems OK.  I did unplug two on the injector connectors and when I turned the ignition got exactly same response in that the engine runs for a few seconds and then died. Having 2 of the injectors unplugged made no difference at all which to me suggests that possibly all injectors are not firing. Flex, you mention zapping the injectors with 12v. I don't want to jump in there and make things worse so can you please explain how to do this. 

Thanks to all so far for your suggestions.
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peteracs
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« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2016, 05:02:43 PM »

Hi

Not wanting to slow you down, but I thought that the car was running fine immediately before this issue and I also thought that the injector 'boost' is for stuck injectors which have not been used for some time?

Please correct me if I am wrong, but if not suggest that the fault is elsewhere, though sounds like the firing of the injectors is the issue, just the why has not been found.

Peter
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flex
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« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2016, 09:46:38 PM »

Thanks for all the replies. Have checked the earth connections and for any leaks and all seems OK.  I did unplug two on the injector connectors and when I turned the ignition got exactly same response in that the engine runs for a few seconds and then died. Having 2 of the injectors unplugged made no difference at all which to me suggests that possibly all injectors are not firing. Flex, you mention zapping the injectors with 12v. I don't want to jump in there and make things worse so can you please explain how to do this. 

Thanks to all so far for your suggestions.


The symptoms sound the same in terms of starting and dying - but as peter says, I doubt that they have suddenly blocked, and wouldn't try it in your case. I just though it would be worth mentioning should someone stumble across this thread with a car that hasn't started for several years.

If the connections seem fine then something is telling them not to fire, or failing to tell them to fire.

if you have a really bad air leak it might cause it - if the afm is miles out. does what you do with the throttle make any difference?
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Bertp
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« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2016, 09:57:17 PM »

The car was running fine before and no matter what I do with the throttle the result is still the same, runs for a few seconds and then dies. 
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lukasdeopalenica
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« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2016, 07:18:26 AM »

I would also suggest you measuring fuel pressure at the feeding hose.
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Bertp
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« Reply #9 on: June 07, 2016, 12:04:54 PM »

I have spent another few hours this morning and have not got very far other than it seems to run a little longer before dying. It starts, runs for a second or so the revs drop and just before dying the revs pick up again, it then runs for a second or so and then dies. I can also get on occasions some response from the throttle to get the revs up for a while before it dies.
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lukasdeopalenica
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« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2016, 07:38:33 AM »

Or try to borrow from someone a working ECU and swap for testing. These units due to age can brake down.
Maybe this table will be helpful.


* tbs.JPG (135.18 KB, 649x891 - viewed 338 times.)
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Lancia Beta HPE 2000i.e. '82 rosso corsa
SAAB 900i 16V Aero, '93 solid black
Subaru Outback 3.0R
Honda CB125 K6 '76 electric blue
Specialized Epic & Stumpjumper
gengis
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« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2016, 08:52:21 PM »

Another worthwhile check would be to ensure that the two sensors on the water rail are connected properly...that the brown sensor body has the brown wiring plug, and the cream body sensor has the cream wiring plug.  Worth a check.
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1983 - Lancia Beta Coupe
1982 - Fiat 124 Spider
2012 - Alfa Romeo Mito
2011 - Fiat Fiorino
2006 - BMW F800st
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« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2016, 11:14:22 PM »

Hi bertp

I have my own problems currently, mine starts and runs but is so incredibly greedy with fuel, it's not funny! .

With what you have described, my daily chip fetcher is a 1996 Mazda MX3 V6, a very complicated beast indeed both mechanically and electrically and

it was rendered unhappy by simply a rip in the concertina like duct from the Mass air flow device to the throttle body with the same 'starts but stops

soon after' symptom you describe, I would be inclined to remove all atmospheric/vacuum connections and scrutinize their integrity by flexing them

at bends and clamping areas looking for cracks, splits and tears, especially on the underside where they hide unseen  Angry I think someone else

mentioned this previously and it's one of those " NO way! is that all it was?" annoyances that crop up from time to time  Roll Eyes.

Hope this helps?

Kev B.
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Bertp
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« Reply #13 on: July 24, 2016, 01:31:16 PM »

Thanks to all for your useful suggestions. I am pleased to say the problem has now been resolved. After exploring your suggestions attention was turned to the ECU. A look at the ports led to tracing a faulty connection of a switching wire from the ECU at the coil pack. Changed the connection and engine fired up and ran on first attempt. Car now running sweet as ever.

Thanks All Again.   
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lukasdeopalenica
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« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2016, 07:39:22 AM »

good to hear it, well done  Cool
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Lancia Beta HPE 2000i.e. '82 rosso corsa
SAAB 900i 16V Aero, '93 solid black
Subaru Outback 3.0R
Honda CB125 K6 '76 electric blue
Specialized Epic & Stumpjumper
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