Lancia Beta Forum

Fuel Filler flap is locked on my Beta and the key is lost ~ is there a simple way to open without utilising the services of a locksmith.
If I can get the flap open without damaging the lock I would be able to remove the lock and get a key cut

On the same topic were Betas made with all different locks for the same car
Apart from the ignition which is a different key I've allways expected the the same key to open/lock the Doors,Glovebox,Petrol filler and Boot but on mine,there is are 3 separate keys
1. One that opens the doors and Glovebox
2 Another that opens the petrol filler
3 and another that opens the boot

All the same key design just different "Dimple" profiles

Is this the norm or does it indicate that the locks have been replaced over the years ?
 

Should be one key for the ignition and one for all the rest  ;)

Regarding opening the flap, I cannot help, sorry...

It is a fairly rudimentary lock like the glove box, so I'm wondering if you can tease it open with a thin blade screwdriver?

Also, given you think you have separate keys for all the locks (not heard of this before) could it be that the lock is seized and one of your keys is correct? If so lots of WD40 while pushing the key in and out. My guess is that your boot lock has been replaced, so try the door key first.

Been working on the lock for days to no avail ~ WD40,Oil,screwdrivers ,knives etc etc
Deffo 3 different locks to the car so undoubtedly they have been changed for whatever the reason over the years ?
When you put the key in the door you can just feel how easy it slides in the lock Mech. and moves the "tumblers" the same key in the petrol filler you can tell is not right and feels its not moving the all the "Tumblers"
Looks like I,ll have to get a locksmith out if he can open the lock without damaging it then I can get a key made,but if his only way past it is to drill it out then I can do that myself.
But just didn't fancy doing that as the chances of finding a another Beta filler lock with or without a key for sale have got to be slim

If the fuel filler neck is in two pieces (mine is,not sure about other versions you may be able to remove the upper section by pulling it back through into the boot once you've undone the bolts that hold it in place. If you can do that you should be able to get to the back of the lock barrel from the boot. It'd be tight but might be worth a go before you blow £100 on a locksmith.

I was thinking the same thing

I might be able to help with a filler flap lock and key. Of course it will not match the door locks unless you are the luckiest man alive!

from the back you can lever off the circlip that holds the L shaped lock tongue to the lock. So possibly making the filler neck more mobile and removing the rubber at the top of the filler neck get a screwdriver to the circlip.

Eric

Had a go at trying to access from the boot ~ Fuel pipe is in two parts after dis assembly of the two sections and the removal of the rubber seal around the inside boot fuel pipe the opening is still small about 1/2" bigger than the pipe itself so cant get past the pipe nor can I remove the pipe as the petrol filler cap is screwed on the pipe the other side and you cant get a finger or any other part past the reverse lip of the petrol cap to try and tease it off (Unscrew).I think even if I was able to unscrew the filler cap and completely remove the fuel pipe from the opening I wouldn't be able to get a hand in to remove the lock.
So I can't see any way forward other than a locksmith or for me to drill the barrel out

You could try a hacksaw blade with tape on the sides of the blade (protect paint) to cut through the lock tongue rather than drilling the lock.

Good Luck

Eric

Eric,
By tongue do you mean the chrome outer circle of the lock on the outside of the filler flap.
If so don't think that would work as its screwed tight to the the flap itself so likely to damage the paint
Been round to a local locksmith shop this morning and asked them if they could unpick the lock,Showed them the dimple profile on the key and was told "never come across that profile before" we don't have the equipment for that job" ~ equipment? what equipment could they need?This is from a locksmith that lays claim to being a member of "Master Locksmiths" and over "40 years experience"
I will phone around more locksmiths but I get the feeling I'm going to have to drill it

Hi

I think Eric means access from in the boot with the blade to cut the tongue which is holding the flap shut. First I would recheck you cannot see the circlip Eric mentioned as that would be the easiest method if you can get any sight of it from inside the boot.

All very frustrating, but I would spend some more time on it before the nuclear option!

Peter

Does Eric mean to feed a junior hacksaw blade from the outside to saw off the lock flap/tab? That way you would possibly be able to just replace that bit of the lock once the fuel flap is open?

What Neil Said!

But if you can reach the circlip with a screw driver from inside the boot and twist you should be and to make the L shape tongue fall off.


Eric

I will go and stare at mine for more inspiration.

OK will give it another go from inside the boot to see if I can get to reach the circlip
Hands already cut to shreds from last time trying to get the cap off
If anyone could load a pic on the lock mechanisim on the inside of the filler cap it would be appreciated
That way I can see what I am going at as its pretty dark through the gap
Not to mention trying to shine a torch through whist holding it in my mouth trying to keep both hands free LOL

Here you go...

Cheers
I'll give that a go again

Success  :) :) :) :) :)
Managed to remove the lock by accessing it from inside the boot
Removed the fuel filler pipe and filler cap back out through the boot ~ surprisingly easier than the last time I tried it and took about 10 mins
It then took circa half an hour to fiddle with the circlip to remove it only difficult due to the way the lock presents itself and hand room at the rear and back of the filler flap
Once the circlip came of the rear lever part of the lock wouldn't budge from the stem due age I guess took another 10 mins with WD40 and rocking back and forth to remove the lever
Then flap opened, lock removed and the jobs a"Goodun"
It's probably not the only way to do the job but found it easier to lie in the boot when trying to remove the circlip
Just need to get a key made for the lock now but at least the lock has been salvaged and no need for a costly locksmith call out


Many thanks to everyone who helped and contributed with advice ~ much appreciated

I am delighted you have won!

As the lock does not match the others you might be best just finding another with a key and then getting a second key cut. You can leave the tongue off and just rock the flap open with the old key if you prefer.

I will have a look and see if I really do have a couple of these locks.

Eric   

Thanks Eric

Well done fella.

It is possible to have the lock re-pinned to match a key by a “good locksmiths”.

But finding a good locksmiths that is prepared to do it is difficult.
I have had my locks re-pinned and matched (to just one key supplied) a couple of times by a good old school locksmith, but the last time I went he said ‘nah mate you can’t do these’.
Until I reminded him he personally done them for me several years ago. 10 mins later it was sorted.

Ian

Hi

That is interesting and I am sure a few of us could find that really useful to have a walk through as a lot have more than one key.....

I may take a look and see on a spare one I have here.

Peter

I won’t pretend I know exactly how to do it but from what I saw the locksmith do, he removed the rectangular ‘staked in place’ side plates and re-arranged the Sausage shape pins so that they all sit level with the key in. This allows the barrel to turn.
Then slide the side plates back in and stake them. Simples!!!

I have done this job and I can confirm it requires great patience. As for when one of the pins and spring fly, well that is what swearing is for!

It will be increasingly necessary as more locks seize.

Eric

I feel a few new photos coming on.....

One lock now disassembled, just need to work out how to change it to suit a specific key and will get it documented, hopefully before too long......

Peter