Lancia Beta Forum

Technical stuff => Heating/Cooling => Topic started by: Neil-yaj396 on April 18, 2015, 11:25:00 AM



Title: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on April 18, 2015, 11:25:00 AM
Can this be removed in situ, or does the radiator need to come out? (1300 Coupe).


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: HFStuart on April 18, 2015, 11:39:49 AM
It can be unscrewed in situ.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on April 18, 2015, 03:14:13 PM
Thanks Stuart. Presume it's just a matter of having the correct size/length spanner to get in there?


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: HFStuart on April 18, 2015, 05:14:17 PM
Yes - IIRC in though the NS wheel arch or up from underneath works best


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: abgwin on April 21, 2015, 11:48:40 PM
Am I hallucinating, or did they move this on the later 2.0 fuel injected version so that it's actually facing outward under the front bumper?

The draincock faces inward, into the engine compartment, as well, making draining the thing a complete mess.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on April 23, 2015, 06:57:09 AM
Am I hallucinating, or did they move this on the later 2.0 fuel injected version so that it's actually facing outward under the front bumper?

The draincock faces inward, into the engine compartment, as well, making draining the thing a complete mess.

The late radiators are quite a bit different, but I seem to remember the thermostat on my injection car still facing into the engine compartment. When I bought the car it was broken, and jury rigged so the fan was always on, so it was one of the first things I fixed. It is 25 years ago though!


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: cheeky monkey on April 23, 2015, 06:13:40 PM
Hi Neil
sorry bit late on reply. You've prob already changed, but if not, as Stuart says it can be done in situ and reached from underneath. Its quite chunky - 30mm
G


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on April 26, 2015, 01:48:00 PM
As Stuart says this is surprisingly accessible once the n/s front wheel and splash guard is off.

Anyway, I thought I'd check the wiring first, as I would have had to fit new connectors for the thermostat that I had bought (spade terminals rather than wired in). I used a length of wire to bypass the thermostat but the fan wasn't coming on. I then wired the fan straight to the battery and it worked OK.

In my electrics kit I found a switch that fitted exactly into the fan end connector block. This was triggering the fan relay when I threw the switch, but it only triggered the fan about once in every five clicks. Checking the relay it was loose in the fuse box. Once pushed home the fan came on every time I threw the switch. I swapped the fan relay with the (redundant) electric window relay as a precaution.

So, I've left the thermostat in for now. In the event that that is faulty too, my switch that I found can be fitted in about thirty seconds to bypass the thermostat.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on May 10, 2015, 03:16:58 PM
The saga continues!

Having tested the old thermostat with the cleaned up wiring and swapped relay it still didn't work. Facing a 400 mile plus journey this weekend I fitted the spare that I had bought.

That worked fine for a whole day; the fan reassuringly coming on as I parked in the hotel car park on Friday afternoon, then working ok through the 60 mile drive yesterday. However, this morning when I started the car the fan was on, and has stayed on since.

I take it this can only be caused by a faulty unit? The fan goes off if you disconnect a terminal from the thermostat.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: droptop on May 10, 2015, 03:43:38 PM
Nothing else besides a faulty sender would make sense under the conditions you've described.
If it wasn't making connection, the supply would be unable to pass to the fan.
Faulty thermosensers aren't always old ones that have many years and miles on them.
I actually have a Peugeot unit in mine and it's been flawless in operation for the five years it's been installed.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on May 10, 2015, 06:12:38 PM

I actually have a Peugeot unit in mine and it's been flawless in operation for the five years it's been installed.


Any idea which Peugeot it was off? There is a fairly limited supply of Beta ones at the moment.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: droptop on May 11, 2015, 07:29:29 AM

I actually have a Peugeot unit in mine and it's been flawless in operation for the five years it's been installed.


Any idea which Peugeot it was off? There is a fairly limited supply of Beta ones at the moment.

Being a bit of a hoarder, I found the 2010 invoice and it's an intermotor part no. INT50100 costing 12.55 from my local motor factor.
i've also used a spare Beta item in my Mk1 Golf GTI with great success so that's also a prospect.
Once the thread is the same and the temperature range is similar, I expect you'll be safe.
i did notice thet the carb models need to be at full temperature to run at their best so as close in temp to OE would obviously be the best choice.
I've just done a quick search but the Intermotor catalogue won't let me enter a part number to find the model so that part number is all I have but it does work!


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: droptop on May 12, 2015, 05:31:39 PM
i visited my ever so helpful motor factor today and they tell me that 'stat was from a 1975 to 1977 Peugeot 204 and 1985 to 1991 Peugeot 505 deisel 2.5l


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on May 12, 2015, 05:53:15 PM
Thanks Frank. For info there are loads of Intermotor 50100 thermostats on ebay. I've ordered one for 10 and I'll report back on how I get on.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: droptop on May 13, 2015, 06:25:16 AM
It amazes me that you can get a stat for a car line a Pug 204 and not a Beta.
Anyone know of a Peugeot 204 club?


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on May 13, 2015, 06:34:57 AM
It amazes me that you can get a stat for a car line a Pug 204 and not a Beta.
Anyone know of a Peugeot 204 club?

It fits a Yugo as well! I guess they were just made in large quantities for cars that no longer exist, so lots left on the self?


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: rossocorsa on May 13, 2015, 07:54:56 AM
Well yugo = fiat so good chance it fits many lancias. These older pattern parts are often listed in a vague fashion but with a bit of effort you can identify the right bits, there is also the disadvantage that parts listed as correct sometimes aren't though! With sensors in many cases it's simply the connectors that vary which is easily solved


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: droptop on May 13, 2015, 10:21:41 PM
Well yugo = fiat so good chance it fits many lancias. These older pattern parts are often listed in a vague fashion but with a bit of effort you can identify the right bits, there is also the disadvantage that parts listed as correct sometimes aren't though! With sensors in many cases it's simply the connectors that vary which is easily solved

Ebay is currently the source of Beta thermostats which are listed for all models but are in fact only suited to Montecarlos as they have a 45 degree turn on the through pipe which is the bar of the "tee" shape as used in FWD Betas.
Another thermostat offered by several suppliers is actually an in-head type so you do need to exercise caution


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on May 23, 2015, 12:22:44 PM
Well, I can confirm that the 50100 switch fits. In fact it appeared identical to the failed unit that I'd bought in March as a Beta one, although once screwed in the terminals sat vertically, rather than horizontal, suggesting the thread might be a bit shorter.

Anyway, fingers crossed that it's third time lucky on tackling this job and this unit will be reliable.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: betabuoy on May 23, 2015, 12:29:39 PM
Neil

If still no joy - and you're confident the wiring is correct - I might have a spare in my garage at Cranwell.  Just let me know if you need it. 

As you say... fingers crossed!

Chris


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on May 23, 2015, 02:21:22 PM
Neil

If still no joy - and you're confident the wiring is correct - I might have a spare in my garage at Cranwell.  Just let me know if you need it. 

As you say... fingers crossed!

Chris

Thanks Chris, did you get my PM about the trophy?


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: betabuoy on May 23, 2015, 05:44:35 PM
Neil
Yes. Got your mail and I thought I'd replied. I'll check again.
Chris


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on June 30, 2015, 09:19:37 PM
Stuck in a traffic jam on the way home today in the blistering heat. Fan clicking on and off nicely, so hopefully this saga is at an end now.

What is alarming is when the fan comes on now (about half way on the temperature gauge), as compared to the old sensor (near the red, if it felt like it!).


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: betabuoy on June 30, 2015, 11:10:42 PM
Neil
Halfway is exactly how it should be but I do like the idea of Theo's mod whereby he's put a switch in the top hose and set it to a cooler level. I'm giving that mod some thought as I don't like the anxiety of seeing the needle even go so far as half way.
Chris


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: rossocorsa on July 01, 2015, 12:16:06 AM
I don't think it's desirable to run too cool, my preferred option has always been a manual override so if you are in a slow queue you always have the option to switch the fans on early.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on July 01, 2015, 06:28:02 AM
I don't think it's desirable to run too cool, my preferred option has always been a manual override so if you are in a slow queue you always have the option to switch the fans on early.

Don't quite understand this one Alan. Not desirable to run cool, but switch the fans on early?


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: rossocorsa on July 01, 2015, 08:30:54 AM
Yeah my brain not functioning properly it was late! My reasoning for liking the manual override is that it allows some extra control without putting extra pressure on the fan all the time. If there is obviously a long slow queue a manual switch gives the option to engage the fan early on you own judgement, otherwise you can stick with the normal cycle.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: Neil-yaj396 on September 10, 2016, 11:39:12 AM
After going through three thermostats in as many years (admittedly the first one had probably lasted 34 years) I decided to bite the bullet and fit this aftermarket unit.

The original Kenlowe version as fitted by Theo to his Trevi does not seem to be available any more. This one was inexpensive (19.99) and I do have some concerns about it's durability, but it was easy to fit, seems to work well and has a very wide range of adjustment. I've set it to come on with the gauge at dead centre, which equates to 95 degrees on the dial.

I don't like fitting non OE parts, but it seems to me that the original units are possibly deteriorating with age? Fortunately, as reported before, the last two failed in the 'on' position.


Title: Re: Radiator Fan Thermostat
Post by: capriblu on September 05, 2017, 09:18:30 PM
Have been doing some work on my car which has necessitated removal of radiator so have decided to get thermoswitch functionality back.  For several years have run on manual switch only running through separate relay but would feel happier knowing that there is a back up if I forget to look!  Will still keep manual switch as optional override to bring fan on earlier if desired (i.e. as per Rossocorsa's  suggestion).  Given manual override option then would prefer to keep thermoswitch at original settings which from my recollection activates at a temperature corresponding to the temp gauge being just slightly over the half way mark.

Original part numbers  Lancia/Fiat 82286103 Spec =  M22 x 1.5  with nominal 92/87 degC on/off.   Intermotor part 50200 is the matching item for this.  The 50100 item has nominal on/off settings about 10 degC lower which is quite a long way off standard.

Searching online for the original Lancia / Fiat part number finds countless good brand new items matching the above for little ....