Lancia Beta Forum

General Category => Members Cars => Topic started by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:14:49 PM



Title: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:14:49 PM
Hi All

I started the restoration posts to the LMC site back in 2010 after I bought the Spyder, but towards the end of 2010 other things took over and 2011 was a washout and only started doing stuff again earlier this year, albeit at a fairly slow speed. I have decided to copy the old posts to here and then attempt to carry on with reports on how it is going, likely to be a long road as I spend 10 weeks a year in France, have a large garden to help with and other weekends are taken up with other activities usually, so grabbing time during the week is my only chance, luckily I work just across the grass from the house and garage, so popping over for a couple of hours is not too hard if I get the time. Target for getting on the road is 2013 late Spring..... (I wish!)

Hopefully some folk will find it useful/entertaining and apologies for those who have suffered it before, but wanted to keep in one place where most of the Beta folk will get access, rather than in the LMC where the Beta traffic appears quite light.

Also apologies for lack of photos from when we bought it as I completely forgot and the bodywork guys only took local shots to illustrate the before/after shots. Eventually there are ones of the full car!

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:19:04 PM
Hi All

I thought it may be useful to document the adventure I have had with the purchase and renovation of a Series 2 pre Facelift Spyder I bought earlier this year. Hopefully it will be of use to some and amusement to others maybe.....

First a bit of history which will hopefully set the scene for the purchase in the first place.

Many moons ago (1979/80) when I was the tender age of 23/24 in my second job as a technical sales engineer in a very small electronics company, I was given one of the directors hand me downs, a lovely bright red Beta HPE 2000 complete with the mustard colour seats - wife liked the car, not the interior (must have been designed by a man she mutters) . Now to be given a car like that when you are just starting out was pretty special and memorable. Probably the most memorable thing was the 'switch' on the accelerator where if you gradually pressed to accelerate things started to happen and then there was this point where the accelerator suddenly became very stiff and required a fair amount of pressure to hit the second choke and then what seemed like all hell broke loose. Great fun! The other thing about the HPE was how practical a car it was (we actually slept in the back with the seats down one time, quite comfy).

So you may ask, why have I gone for a Spyder, not the HPE? Well there was one memorable day, mid summer, gloriously warm when the HPE went in for a service and the loan car was an old beat up Spyder. Now this was real fun, open top and loads of go (as it appeared then). We had a good run around that evening in the car as the HPE was not ready for collection until the next day and the memory has stuck with me since.

After that I moved onto more sober cars and have always had to have more practical cars eg estates for work, dogs etc ever since. Also as I used to drive a fair amount of miles each year with work, I soon learnt that automatics were preferable in terms of tiredness and relaxed driving compared to manuals. The other issues with having an older car was that budgets were always allocated to moving on up the housing ladder/redecoration/extensions and until recently I did not have a garage to store any older car in either.

Now fast forward to the beginning of this year and a combination of things meant that I could satisfy my ever growing ache for an old car. I now have suitable dry garage space, my father in law left us some money on passing away, some of which my wife wanted me to spend on something for myself, the current house is pretty well sorted and work is relatively quiet and I have time to spend on a project other than work.

I enlisted the help of a neighbour who spends his time buying/selling/playing around with old sports cars and bits thereof and we started looking on Ebay and other online places for a suitable Spyder. The idea was to buy something which needed some work and a repaint, but not a complete shed. Surprisingly around the beginning of the year several opportunities presented themselves, but for one reason or another we could not visit them to see if they were suitable (experience teaches you that pictures lie or at the very least conceal the truth, never the other way it appears). We finally saw one on Ebay which was a white 1600 and had the right sort of 'feeling'. It was advertised as a runner, but garaged for 10 years, run out of the garage every so often to check it was ok. The car was for sale by the son of the owner who had owned it for many years, although not the original owner from new. The mileage was down as 24000 which I still am not convinced by, but cannot prove either way. We visited it and noted the bad news with the floor pan, cracked windscreen, needed replacement lights (silvering gone) and some sill work, but that was sort of expected. It was complete and pretty original which was important. So I duly bid and won it against mainly traders for the princely sum of £913. I hired a trailer and collected the end of March 2010. So far so good and exciting times were to come, should have it road worthy by summer (or so I thought)!!

I will try to hunt out pictures of the original HPE and scan them, also I lost the original pictures of the car as purchased, but have asked if the seller can let me have any, so will post when/if I get them.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:24:15 PM
Failed miserably on the HPE photo front, all the photos from that era have decayed and are of no use... No news on the sellers photos yet.

My original thoughts on how to restore the car was to send away to a specialist bodywork/painter and have all that side handled professionally, to organise the trimming with another specialist and I would handle the mechanical & electrical stuff which I felt quite happy to cope with.

So with the car all safely tucked away in my garage, I decided to ask a friend of my neighbour, who has been in the restoration business, specifically the bodywork and painting side for a number of years (John), to have a look at the car. He had recently teamed up with a young guy (Tom) who was a bit of a genius on the 'forming anything out a sheet of metal' group. I have to confess I have no idea how these people can take a sheet of metal, realtively simple tools and form the complex shapes such as bottom of sills etc, my limit is definitely drilling holes and polishing as far as bodywork is concerned.

After looking at the car for a while his question was, do I want it to be tidied up for now so I can get on a use it or have a more serious restore which would obviously cost more and take more time? Being somewhat niave I said that a tidy up was my idea, but could he have a look at the front wings as they did not appear to fit too well. We agreed a price based on an hourly rate and that I would strip off as much as possible to reduce his time spent on it. At this time it was generally felt a cost of £2.5-£3k was likely. All was good with the world and I set too enthusiastically stripping off anything which was not painted. Also I removed the broken windscreen which was  trial in itself (is there an easy way?).

The car was then collected during May and they commenced work on it. It was not long before I received a call saying that after hitting the internal floor with a cleaning wheel that the job was likely to be somewhat longer than originally anticipated. I knew about the drivers side footwell, but the pasenger side was also bad and that the rear passenger areas which we knew about were also much worse. Below are some photos of the internal horrors unveiled.



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:32:03 PM
A few more


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:32:39 PM
More



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 02, 2012, 02:36:14 PM
Some of the sills


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 03, 2012, 04:54:15 PM
So having reached this point with the interior, John and Tom pressed on with the front end, specifically the wings which were to be removed. It was at this point where a major decision had to be made as the wings had hidden a whole load of previous bodge work which was almost impossible to see. The inner wings were pretty bad with a repair to one of the suspension turrets being simply two pieces of metal 'stuck' on top of each other, ie very little support on one side for the suspension mount and if the car had been used would pobably have resulted in the strut coming through the bonnet at worst. The other most amusing thing was the weights of the wings. One was approx twice the weight of the other - great stuff filler....

So the decision was made to not simply 'tidy up', but to spend some real time on sorting out properly the parts which required it. This would mean the whole project would take a significantly longer time to complete, more money as ever and hopefully be a better car at the end.

A few snaps to illustrate what was hidden below!


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 03, 2012, 04:55:05 PM
2 more


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 03, 2012, 04:57:35 PM
Whilst John & Tom were beavering away I had been on the lookout for a donor car for the bits which I knew I needed and for the bits I did not know I needed yet, but sure as eggs are eggs, I would need some extra parts. The main problem I found with this approach was that I had bought a Series 2 pre Facelift car, the interior of which I much prefer to the later cars, and pretty much all of the cheap cars I saw available for breaking at the time were the later facelift versions. This meant that I was going to have to use the interior I had as the facelft is completely different. The main items I was after however were the front headlight clusters, some oddments of wiring, rear light clusters and a decent windscreen. I figured that they alone were going to cost the best part of £200, so when a car came along for not that much more than that, I bought it. The parts were duly removed (fortunately the parts car had severe rust around the screen, so the windscreen came out complete with the sealing gunk without any real forcing). I had assumed that the windscreen was the same for all Series 2 cars which luckily was correct! The car also had a half reasonable exhaust and as mine was pretty shot thought it might come in useful as a starter before I splash out on a full stainless version. As it happened Stuart Read on the forum offered one for a good price which after I agreed to buy it he kindly dropped off at my place. So I now have a decent one to use which should last a few seasons + usable spare.

Back to the bodywork. After some clearing out in the boot and sills another batch of holes appeared and the ones which we sort of knew about in the outer/upper door sills which needed attention, see pics below.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 03, 2012, 04:58:17 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 03, 2012, 04:58:43 PM
+1


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 07:55:05 AM
We had decided at the start not to delve too deep into the external sections of the rear end of the car which appeared solid, albeit with some evidence of previous repair, so a straight forward paint was all that was decided upon. The final parts to clean up were the doors, bonnet, front valance, around the windscreen and rear over bar. The windscreen channel was in good condition and the over bar had some rust, but not too serious. The front valance required some work, though pretty solid and the bonnet had had previous repairs/filling done  on the front edge and in the absence of a suitable replacement it was decided to patch up as best as possible, as trying to weld extra  metal onto the bonnet could result in it distorting and hence being unusable (having no knowledge of welding, I had to bow to those who should know). The bonnet on the spares car was also poor and was the later 2000 version with the raised centre section, so not useful as a replacement.

The original idea with the doors was to leave the stainless trim in place and tidy up around it. With the work to be done having expanded, I felt it was pointless going through the other work and not removing the trim and sorting out the issues below, as it transpired this was the best course of action as the pictures show, the corrosion beneath the trim was much more significant than you would have imagined from just looking at it in its original state. The rest of the doors were in good condition thankfully.

So we now had a starting point for putting it back together.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 07:55:39 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 07:55:53 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 07:57:33 AM
As I have quite a few photos of most of the work done, I will post each section of the car repaired with a before/during/after where possible to show how the repair was effected. I guess for some/most this may be tedious, but for anyone hoping to do any similar work you may find it useful. As a non welder myself I find it amazing what can be achieved with a piece of metal, welder and grinder.

Firstly, one of the decisions which I had to make was the replacement wings. We tried to source some new metal wings 'off the shelf' without success and did not want to use 'used' ones. John came up with Smith & Deakin Plastics of Worcester who had fibreglass ones available as a stock part. He had previous experience with the company and was confident they would be of a high quality both in shape and in mannufacture. As the budget was already exploding and the only obvious alternative was to have a pair custom made, I plumbed for the fibreglass ones. If I had wanted to keep the car truly original, then not a decision I would have taken, but at the end of the day it is for just me to run around in, so a reasonable compromise I felt.

At the same time as this, an edict from the wife was ringing in my ears, that if the car was 'tat' she was not going near it. So I truned my time to sorting out the trimming of the seats. The seats in the Pre F/L are of what my neighbour calls 'a funky design'. I have to agree in that altough they do not hug you like the later seats, they do have a period style to them which is different to most more modern seats. The original meterial in the card was vinyl throughout and the covering on the drivers side had definitely seen better days. Given that the car was mainly to be garaged when not being used and it was to be used mainly during the summer, vinyl was not looking too attractive as a replacement material and I started asking one or two companies the cost of replacing the covering with leather. I wanted to keep the colours pretty much as they were which was the tanny coloured seats with mixture of the tan and dark brown on the door cards, A & B posts etc. I felt this went well with the brown of the dash/instrument cluster/steering wheel.

After I had a couple of rough quotes, a chance conversation with one of my friends in the village brought up a contact he knew in Melton who although he works for a large trimmer, also takes on private work in the evenings. When I found out he also had 40+ years as a trimmer, had his own company for 20+ years and his pricing was very attractive for the seats/leather purchase, I sent the seats off to be done as a starter, with the intention of having the rest of the cards etc done if the seats came out ok. Never having had any seats trimmed before and hearing the odd horror story from various people I spoke to about it, I felt it was a step into the dark with only a gut feel that it would be ok.......


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 07:59:46 AM
Here are a few photos of the front drivers footwell repair, before/during/after


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 08:00:51 AM
Now we have a hole, fill it


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 08:01:27 AM
And finished


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 08:05:38 AM
And the passenger side ......


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 08:06:14 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 04, 2012, 08:06:46 AM
Finished floor pan


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 05, 2012, 11:47:43 AM
These are the passenger side rear seat area. As well as sorting the panels, a new rear seatbelt fixing plate was fabricated and included for both sides. The old ones were well corroded. Again the finished job had the matting applied as a last job.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 05, 2012, 11:48:18 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 05, 2012, 11:49:02 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 05, 2012, 11:49:41 AM
And finally we get here


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: MattNoVAT on October 07, 2012, 01:25:27 PM
I'm impressed with the rear turret/arch repair and also the floorpan.  It would have been easy to just weld a flat steel plate in the floor but they have replicated the original floor shape, its details like that that make all the difference IMHO.

I'm keen to see how the repairs on the doors go, the usual place for the start of the decay... it looks a challenge but am sure it can be repaired.

You are right not to weld repair sectioning into the bonnet - this is very tricky as the panels distort due to the heat. I had this issue when I had the holes for the two badges on the boot welded up, so the panel beater had to spend time putting that right after the welding was completed.   I now prefer to cut the pins off the back of the badges and stick them on with body adhesive (Masterbond)  The holes for those pins are the weak spot and the starting point for the rot.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:09:09 PM
Hi Matt

Yes Tom was a bit of  wizz on the english wheel, I was told. All of the panels apart from the wings were fabricated by them.

So on with the rest of the work.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:23:12 PM
Now the drivers side rear seat..


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:23:53 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:24:34 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:25:09 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:32:04 PM
The final photos are of the repair work around the rear turrets, but in the boot. Note they had to cut out a section of the rear passenger bulkhead to gain access to the corroded area around some of the nearside rear turrent.

Near side rear turret photos first


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:32:37 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:33:12 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:36:58 PM
Drivers side rear turret in the boot


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 09, 2012, 12:37:34 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 07:36:43 AM
Moving on to the front wings. The inner wing on the near side was not particularly bad (unlike the drivers side), here are the photos of the repair


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 07:37:17 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 07:37:55 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 08:39:10 AM
The driver's inner wing proved to be a whole load more work than the passenger side. Apart from a distinct lack of metal, there was a patch to around the turret which was not even welded fully and was downright dangerous.... Not an MOT  pass I feel.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 08:39:49 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 08:40:42 AM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 09:01:59 AM
After sorting the turret, on with the bulkhead end and building up around the turret area.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 09:02:39 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 09:03:27 AM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 04:31:12 PM
And last but not least a patchwork quilt to sort out the headlamp end. Simples (for some I guess!)


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 04:31:56 PM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 04:32:49 PM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: MattNoVAT on October 10, 2012, 04:45:40 PM
I was lucky enough to find a new Coupe inner wing in Austria, which save me from the pain of having one fabricated. 

I weighed up the cost of the inner wing against the amount of time spent repairing it in sections and figured that it had to be more cost effective to chop out the old and weld in the new.  Your man seems to be cracking on at a fair pace or has this all happened and your posting up pics in sequence?


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 06:52:03 PM
I was lucky enough to find a new Coupe inner wing in Austria, which save me from the pain of having one fabricated. 

I weighed up the cost of the inner wing against the amount of time spent repairing it in sections and figured that it had to be more cost effective to chop out the old and weld in the new.  Your man seems to be cracking on at a fair pace or has this all happened and your posting up pics in sequence?

Hi Matt

All of this was originally posted in 2010 on the LMC site, just never updated it past what they did and decided it was better placed here so am transferring what I listed then. I will then follow up with the work I have done since then, which is not as dramatic and taken a much longer time. The car was with the guys to do the bodywork and painting from around end of May to August and they spent around 200 hours on it from memory.

I was not really aware at the time where to go to get/ask for parts and as such we decided to press on with self fab work which as it turned out was a good job, albeit expensive, though at the time I had the money to play with so no complaints about that.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: MattNoVAT on October 10, 2012, 09:07:30 PM
I had a blonde moment Peter, my apologies - I went back to the very start and read the first two posts...which explains everything.

So how far is the car along now?  Are you staying with the original white body colour?


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 09:29:01 PM
Hi Matt

Currently there is less in it than when the guys returned it to me back in Aug 2010, which sounds as though nothing much has happened, but I decided that as I had gone this far, I might as well go further and tidy up a whole lot before putting it back together. So I now have fully stripped out the main cabin including the dash and heater. The tank has been removed, cleaned and painted, the underneath has been cleaned and painted. The boot has been cleaned, painted and some waxoyl added. The main cabin floor and bulkheads have been painted and waxoyl has been added where I can get. One job I had done was have a windscreen installed and then realised that the trim needed to be put in first, then the screen glued in.... So out it came again, a pain, but there we go.

I had all the seats covered in leather and the door cards, console and rear parcel shelf covered in vinyl and some leather on the cards. Also replaced a lot of the electrical connectors in the engine bay and the boot.

Currently about to start putting the boot and tank back in, so the long road putting it back together starts......

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 10, 2012, 10:35:51 PM
Hi Matt

Oops forgot the colour question, staying with as near to the original Lancia colour white as we can. the car when bought had what my guy called a fridge white which was a 80/90s respray and was keen to go for a more original colour. We went for base coat and lacquer finish due to some issues they had during spraying, and then polished the lacquer to give an old polished finish.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 07:48:35 AM
Moving along, we (that is the Royal 'we' of course) attacked the door sills. The main area of problem is that area directly below the A post where all the water from the wheels gets blasted against the end of the sill/inner wing. Having looked at a couple of Spiders it is one of the classic places for some serious rust. The pictures pretty much say it all, a) how bad is was b) how it was built up in stages to a pretty impressive end result (to my novice eyes anyway). First up is the passenger side


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 07:49:30 AM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 07:50:15 AM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 07:51:06 AM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 07:51:32 AM
+1


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:11:11 PM
And the drivers side, pretty much the same at the end of the sill, but also there was some significant repairs needed to the upper part of the sill both back and front which required some more of the 'hand made parts' to be manufactured.

Rear part of the sill/door first


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:11:45 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:14:40 PM
Moving on to the front part of the drivers sill the repair here was to both the upper part of the sill next to the A post and the area where the sill meets the inner front wing.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:15:36 PM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:16:20 PM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:18:46 PM
As a slight aside from the main body, here is the repair to the battery box which I guess has suffered from either an accumulation of water or/as well as a leaking battery at some stage.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 11, 2012, 03:19:32 PM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 15, 2012, 08:49:48 AM
Ok, back to the wings. Attached to the rear of the inner front wings is a plate which I guess is designed to catch all the crap thrown up by the wheel. These were as you would imagine in a poor state, so new ones were fabricated and fitted. As we were using fibreglass wings which would 'rub' against these plates, the outer edge has had some rubber 'padding' added to reduce wear on the wings (not shown).


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 15, 2012, 08:50:21 AM
+2


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: MattNoVAT on October 15, 2012, 10:30:15 AM
The original splash guards also had a rubber strip stapled (yes, stapled!) the the outer edge.  I guess to stop friction on the main outer wing but also to form a rudimentary seal against the water coming off the road wheel.  This seal fails dismally and those original splash guards usually rot out at the bottom and expose the front leading edge of the sill to water and you end up with a nice little collection of damp mud/grit where the tinworm lives.

BTW - I recognise those pictures Peter!  ;D


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on October 15, 2012, 02:22:25 PM
The original splash guards also had a rubber strip stapled (yes, stapled!) the the outer edge.  I guess to stop friction on the main outer wing but also to form a rudimentary seal against the water coming off the road wheel.  This seal fails dismally and those original splash guards usually rot out at the bottom and expose the front leading edge of the sill to water and you end up with a nice little collection of damp mud/grit where the tinworm lives.

BTW - I recognise those pictures Peter!  ;D

Matt, yes you asked about them I think some time ago. Will be getting onto the work done on the doors very soon......

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on December 05, 2012, 05:58:11 PM
Bit of a long wait, but finally have some time to log some more of the work done.

Next up was the front valance. This was not too bad, but had some rusted away parts which were 'rebuilt'. The final picture shows during the spraying.



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on December 05, 2012, 06:05:50 PM
On to the wings. These, as was mentioned before, were fibreglass (cost & availability) and on offering up two issues were apparent.

1) The fit to the valance required the valance to be 'adjusted', there were one or two other small adjustments required to allow a snug fit to the rest of the body, though not too significant.

2) The lower part of the wing near the A post did not fit the profile required at all. I guess that the wing pattern is off either a Coupe or HPE. Either way, it had to be cut and reshaped to allow the lower trim to fit. This was achieved with some ally and rivets. The end result was a pretty good fit, including around the headlights, which although still not as tight as some I have seen, was a big improvement over what we originally had. Photos show the mod and the wings fitted after spraying and the grill & lights fitted. As this was a pre F/L 1600 it had the chromed grill and headlight surrounds. Sadly the original headlight surrounds were broken where the screw fixes and the grill had been painted before. We had a couple of later black headlight surrounds, so cleaned them up and the grill which was a bit of a mess and painted both with 'silver' paint. End result is good in my eyes, but probably not as good as original. One has to compromise on somethings......


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on December 05, 2012, 06:06:48 PM
+3


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on December 27, 2016, 11:38:00 AM
Hi All

Well I thought it was time I resurrected this thread to give an update and to record what has happened to date.....

The original posts look to have been made in 2012, but all of the work up to that point were actually completed by the bodywork and paint guys up to late August 2010 if my memory serves me well.

From that point it was over to me to do the rest and that has lead to a very slow progression which I will try to itemise below. The main problem for me as for many was trying to juggle work and home life with trying to spend time on the car. I have had significant periods where I just gave up on the car to concentrate on earning enough to allow me to finish full time work, which I achieved earlier this year. Work on the car has therefore progressed somewhat more the latter part of this year than for some significant time. As to target dates for completion, who knows, but 2017 is looking sort of do-able if I keep on with it through the winter months.

I will try to dig out any photos I have made over the years, but in truth there are not that many. I will post a few of where we are now which in truth does not look so different albeit with a lot of cleaning and painting having been done.

So on to what I have managed to achieve so far......

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on December 27, 2016, 11:47:53 AM
One of the things I realised very early on after getting the car back was I should have stripped it down fully when we realised it would take a huge amount of effort and cost to repair the bodywork, lesson learnt for the next project!!

So list of work carried out, bound to miss a few things, but here we go...

Remove petrol tank, cleaned outside (wire brush in drill mainly) and painted with Hammerite and Waxoyl, checked sensor and inside for rust, none obvious inside or much outside, happy camper as hard to replace. Also cleaned and painted the filler petrol pipe and replaced the pipe work in the spill prevention arrangement.

Removed most of the inside that was left including dash etc, leaving steering column and cabling. Cleaned (mainly wire brush) and painted all of the inside with Hammerite.

In general the wires were ok, so just replaced all of the connectors with new and soldered and crimped them to ensure decent connection, amazing how many connectors there are. Also used slip on covers for the connectors. A lot of the sellers just sell the crimp only type with pre fit covers which are no use if you want to solder them.

Cleaned up the front and rear bumpers and painted the none stainless parts, also tidied up the rear number plate lights and have replaced the bulbs with Led ones.

Cleaned the rear lights, both had some tape over part of them. One had cracked lenses, so was unusable. These are the early style ones with the smaller red reflector. Fortunately I organised with Angelo in Oz to swap a newly refurbished one for the cracked one, so now have two almost perfect ones which was a full result as they are really hard to find without cracks.

The boot was cleaned and painted with Hammerite.

The car had the original rubber mats unlike later cars with carpet which is a neat item in my book as has a large Zagato 'Z' mounded into the main one. There were some tears which I have used inner tube repair patches to mend, not sure if this will endure, but better than nothing.

All the wiring in the boot and the most of the main compartment has been wrapped with loom tape, the engine bay will be done with the same when the engine bay is put back together.

The front suspension has been removed, the struts stripped down, but dampers left in. These are the removable type so can be replaced if needed. I spent a while sorting out the bearing at the top of the strut. One of them was shot, the other ok. Sourcing one was a trial, finally finding one with a guy in the US, but he did not have a seal for it, but managed to find one in a box of parts that came from a scrap car I bought, do not look forward to finding any more..... The struts were cleaned and painted as were the springs, they look nice now, no idea how long it will last.

The lower wishbones had the bushes replaced with PU parts which fit a 355 Ferrari, see other thread on this subject. I also replaced the lower ball joint.

I stripped the hubs and replaced the bearings, again an interesting hunt for genuine European parts, the original rings were a weird design with no obvious tool available, so replaced with bearing rings from Mark. I had to get the local garage to press the bearings out and replace with new ones. The CV boots were shot, so sourced new CV joints and boots, but despite getting the correct part number they all tend to be different and so far have only one that fits ok, hopefully I should have a second soon.

The rack had the centre boot all corroded as normal by the heat from the exhaust, so removed it, cleaned and rebuilt with new centre boot and filled with fresh oil. Freed up the track rod adjusters and installed new track rod ends.

Underneath was cleaned with drill with wire brush as good I as could, then painted and Waxoyl'd, very mucky job.

The front subframe was cleaned the best I could and painted in situ, so not the easiest or best way, but at least it has some protection. Same for the main engine bay. In order to do this a lot of parts were removed including the servo and brake master cylinder. This master cylinder was rebuilt with new seals supplied by Lukas, who also supplied the seals for the brake cylinders which one of the current jobs partly finished.

The engine has been degreased as best I could with it in situ. Various parts have been removed, cleaned and if needed painted to help prevent father rust. These include -

Two off water rails, starter motor, alternator, fuel pump, sump, oil pump, cam covers, various brackets.

The front lights were removed and the metal parts all cleaned and painted. I accidentally broke one of the lenses so need to replace it, it was not original, but I may just replace with matching set.

The screen was originally installed after the spraying, however it had to removed as the roof lining needs to be installed before the screen is refitted.

The old rear hood was pretty poor, so sourced one from a US supplier. I went for a canvas style rather than vinyl. I cleaned up and painted the frame and installed the new hood, not too happy with my work, so may have to refit, still have issues with clips not latching ok, but have left for the time being as plenty of other jobs to be getting on with.

The wheel arches have had stone chip applied, but do aim to fit liners from later cars to at least the front to aid in keeping them rot free.....

The wiper mechanism was removed, cleaned and greased. Where they come through the scuttle the bushes were pretty crudded up and would have made the wipers very slow, suspect it is a very common problem.

Think that is all for now..... Hopefully more to follow



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on January 11, 2017, 05:28:57 PM
Here are a three photos as of today.... Not great quality as taken on iPhone


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on January 11, 2017, 07:09:35 PM
Great to see a wonderful Spyder coming together I wish Mine was at this stage.

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: HFStuart on January 11, 2017, 09:06:12 PM
Starting to look good!


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: smithymc on January 11, 2017, 10:42:53 PM
Very nice Peter. That is going to be lovely.

Keep it up.

Mark



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: SIMid on January 12, 2017, 05:20:55 AM
Wow!!

What a job, but done so well!!


Title: Re:
Post by: dommorello on January 17, 2017, 01:40:56 PM
Looking good! Let's hope not too far off driving!! Keep up great work!!

Sent from my HTC 2PS6200 using Tapatalk


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 04, 2017, 02:24:27 PM
Hi

Ok, bit more of an update, managed to get regular time on the car now, even with the cold temperatures (not too wet thankfully), I have to work with the garage doors open so pray for light winds.......

Jobs done since the last update, again bound to miss a few, but here goes. There are some much better photos from a real camera attached of the engine bay as of today.

Tidied up the wiring loom in the cabin around the steering column. Had to drop the column as where it passes over the column support was very tight. Found that it had previously had a small 'mod' done to the two indicator wires , they appear to have been cut and a piece of wire inserted (maybe due to chaffing?), the method of connection was twist the wires together, tape with insulating tape and hope...... Replaced with soldered joints and heat shrink, then the whole lot loom taped up to where it emerges into the engine bay.

Installed the steering column bulkhead seal when I worked out what it looked like, then put the steering column and rack all tightened up (after I sorted the foot brake and clutch mechanisms, see below).

Installed the fusebox support and started installing the fusebox and nearby relays, however need to get a decent blowup of the wiring circuit made as there are way too many red wires..... and there is little slack in the wiring at this point. The wiring in the engine bay as you can see is a complete rats nest at the moment, will need to have the tape taken off all and relaid out then taped up when I have the fusebox and relays installed.

Jobs now turned to the engine bay.

Removed, painted, greased and replaced the clutch and foot brake mechanisms. This is a right hand car, so a bit more to it than left hand ones I think. Clutch cable greased the best I could. A pretty fiddly job for the foot brake and having the column loose helped.

Removed the clutch cable tripod piece on the gearbox, cleaned and painted, then found it was twisted, so had to start again with one of a spare engine..... Removed, cleaned and painted the gear lever on the top of the gearbox, also removed the clutch activation lever which was and absolute pig. It has splines and they were rusted, had to leave soaking in WD40 for about 5 days, eventually it came off. Now cleaned and painted. Bothe the clutch and gear lever have had Copperslip applied so they should come off easily next time....

Clutch cable installed with its protecting grommet near the battery box.

Installed the already cleaned and painted cowling for the radiator, the radiator and the electric fan. Checked out what pipe work I had and ordered some new stainless jubilee clips. Still need the odd pipe to replace poor ones, but will get around to that soon.

Installed the already painted bonnet stay and the spring loop for the bonnet.

Installed the bonnet angle pieces which go from the strut tops to the front of the car.

Then a major event. I had previously installed one of the update kits for the gear linkage and now actually installed all the gear change items from the gear lever in the cabin to the gear lever on the gearbox. This includes the swivel arrangement just below the rack at the back of the engine. I thought I may have to take the rack out, but thankfully there is just enough room. Various parts were cleaned and painted along the way and plenty of grease applied to the swivel and the metal joints of the connecting bar supplied with the kit. All looks very tidy to my eyes (see photo).

That will do for now, but next up are getting the hubs back together, that is for the next post......

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: HFStuart on March 04, 2017, 02:38:02 PM
It's really coming together. Don't forget to connect the reversing light switch while you can get to it!


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 04, 2017, 03:25:40 PM
It's really coming together. Don't forget to connect the reversing light switch while you can get to it!

Hi Stuart

Thanks, yes easy enough with the side panel off and no battery tray.

On that subject the guys who restored the body actually welded the battery tray onto the supports, all well and good unless you want to get the engine out I think, so that is why the supports are a mess, I drilled out the welds. Have to trim the supports and sort some sort of brackets for the battery tray. I have a fresh one all painted ready to go on when the time is right!

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 06, 2017, 09:03:52 AM
Hi All

A wet Sunday here, so what would normally be a garden day, has been swapped for a car day (the garden day is now Monday, i.e. today....)

One of the jobs I was least looking forward to was tightening the hub nuts up tight enough. I know the effort required to get them off which resulted in a visit to the local garage. The main issue was how to fasten the hub with putting strain on the gearbox etc. So.... I dreamt up a framework using angle iron, in the end all I actually needed was a decent piece of old angle iron (the remnants of one of my neighbours gates as it happens) drilled to accept two of the hub bolts and relieved so the socket would fit on the nut. This was fastened using some old hub bolts which were packed with washers and I used the spacer which goes in front on the disc normally to pack them out so there was just the thread showing and did not stick out the back of the hub too much. Then you could tighten it all up nicely. Photo of it in situ below. I could then apply a load of effort to the nut with out undue strain to the drivetrain. I am lucky enough to have a monster torque wrench (see below) which just goes up to the required torque. With this all in place it was a very simple job to torque up to the correct value, a great relief all round.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 06, 2017, 09:07:08 AM
After that it was fairly plain sailing to assemble the new disks, spacers, brake yoke and the already rebuilt calipers using Copperslip on the wedge pieces to hope keep them from seizing in future. Both sides completed by the end of the day. Only job now are the brake pipes and final connection of the roll (sway) bar. Altogether a satisfying day.
 


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: smithymc on March 06, 2017, 11:28:23 AM
Inspirational stuff Peter- keep it going!

Makes my fiddling with window regulators and Rev counters seem pretty minor- not that any of it has been successful- yet.

Mark


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: mangocrazy on March 06, 2017, 03:25:20 PM
Very much liking the 'special tool' to get the hub nuts tightened up, Peter. Using the mass of the car as mechanical advantage (or disadvantage, depending on your view). Must try and remember that one. We had a similarly wet Sunday, which I used as a carb, thermostat and exhaust day (but motorbike, not car).


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 06, 2017, 04:19:38 PM
One thing I forgot to mention was the wishbone ball joint. As with the CV joint, different suppliers/manufacturers, all saying for the Beta.

I already had a new one from a few years ago which fits really nicely and looks like the originals on the car, the second one I ordered end of last year and it was a Delphi part TC195 which according to info is 100% for the car. It fits into the hole just fine and locates on the hole in the hub again perfect, the problem is that when tightened the stud part protrudes too far and interferes with the CV joint, not too useful. In the interest of actually making progress and the next one may also have issues, I cut just over 5mm from the top of the stud part, now fits perfectly. If you need to make this mod, do not forget to put a nut on BEFORE you cut the thread and then file down the rough edge. This makes putting the nut back on a whole lot simpler. On the ball joint there is obviously no spanner point on the stud, so I used a bit of an old rubber pipe wrapped round the tapered section and held it with grips, that way you can screw/unscrew the nut without damaging the taper.

Peter


Title: Re:
Post by: dommorello on March 08, 2017, 09:16:50 AM
Great work Peter! Awesome progress. In our experience great to get thinks fitted but as like your issue with rack ya can't get to excited once something has been fitted as it is most probably going to come off again to fit something else. Keep up good work!!

Sent from my HTC 2PS6200 using Tapatalk


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 19, 2017, 02:34:49 PM
Not much achieved recently as had some work work and refurbishing a kitchen and cleaning a flat to do, all very boring and getting in the way..... Still they do bring in some useful cash.

Anyway enough of my moaning. I made a little progress to date.

1) Ordered and received the T pieces for the heater pipework mod, see photo. Going to refit the heater before I sort out the pipework.

2) Installed the new HEL brake flexible hoses which I ordered ages ago from Camskill. The original ones were incorrect, had to return and send a pattern. The replacements are spot on. a couple of points -

           a) They do not have the small locating dowel of the originals which locate on the calliper. I do not think this is a big issue.
           b) The end which attaches to the inner wing have a round profile with a nut at one end, the original Beta ones have two flats for using a
               spanner. This means the locating bracket on the inner wing are also not fully round. The solution is a small amount of fettling with a round
               file to make them fit. The original retaining clips are a perfect fit on the new hoses.
           c) There is a retaining clip on the strut for the two hoses. I reused the original rubber grommet, but the hoses are much thinner than the
               originals, so I used some old inner tube to pad out the hose and make it a snug fit. I also had to slit the old rubber grommet to get it off
               the original hoses, so I used a ty-wrap to hold the long thin end together. End result I think is quite neat and should do the job.



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on March 19, 2017, 02:50:43 PM
One thing I did manage to have a play with last week, which is my next task, is to look to replace all the brakes pipes.

Never have tried this before, so leap in the dark. I have a Bubble flaring tool by Sykes Pickavant which I was given by my father and have bought a couple of bending tools, pipe cutter and a number of screw ends. Until I started looking I did not realise there were different 'flares' used on brake lines, the 'Bubble" being the one used on moderns normally and older European cars from what I can understand.

So far results have been 1 x really good one, several average to poor ones made. I need to get some more practice before I go for broke on the long lengths. It looks like I need to measure the length and make up one end before I start bending as some of the routing will be a challenge and will not leave much room to flare the end after bending in situ.

Here are the two bending tools, happy with the yellow one, will have to go carefully with the blue handled one which is handy when there is not a lot of room to effect a bend.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on January 27, 2020, 11:14:20 AM
Hi All

Well, long time since I posted an update and in reality a long time since I did any work on the car. Reasons were mainly down to all change at home. We decided in 2017 to move house i.e. downsize and I was going to reduce my hours of paid for work (I work for myself) and was spending a fair amount of time getting into road cycling as well. We moved house eventually back end of 2018 which entailed not only a house move, but moving all my Beta spares and garage contents to my parents house, putting all my work computer stock into a large rental container (we bought and sold second user computer gear). Then we started making the mods to the new house which has taken just over a year. Part of this means I have sorted out the new (double) garage to be reasonably draft proof via a roller shutter door which makes winter work most acceptable especially with a small space heater, changed all the strip lights to LEDs ones, which was a great result, reduced the doubles to singles for essentially the same light output as the old fluorescents and sealed the concrete floor to reduce the dust.

The Beta was moved across early in 2019 and has been just covered up until recently.

Middle of the year I had to do a large service on the Saab which was due including usual oil change etc, but also included the cam belt, brake fluid and auto gearbox oil replacement, none of which I had done before on it, so big learning curve especially the cam belt which involves a fair amount of parts to be removed. It would have been easier if I could have moved the Beta outside, so pretty cramped. Eventually all sorted and the Saab is now outside under a protective cover when not in use which is most of the time.....

So around November last year I managed top start work on the Beta. I still have the water pipework to finish, but decided to start on the last big job underneath which is the rear suspension. So there followed several days of trying and eventually succeeding in removing the rear hubs, brakes and struts. The retaining bolts between the struts and the hub proved to be very hard work, some taking a good hour or more to remove with liberal application of easing fluid and a pry bar etc. The end result was everything was removed except the rear suspension arms which attach to the centre of the car. On inspection the bushes appear good and replacing one of the bushes in these arms was an absolute pain, so they will remain as is. The other item which was not really worn, just old, was the rear disks, which were just rusty, but no obvious wear, unlike the fronts.

The rest of the items including dampers (original replaceable type fortunately), hub bearings, callipers, spring top metal plates and hub retaining rings are to be replaced/resealed. I was fortunate to have a couple of the rear callipers which did not have the bleed nipples sealed and look ok. I also have a new seal kit for them.

One item I almost left alone was the rear brake balancer fixed to the rear anti roll bar. This adjusts the effort to the rear brakes when the car 'lifts' at the back. I decided to remove it and very pleased I did. There is a plunger in the unit operated vi a bar from the anti roll bar and covered with a rubber boot. Under this boot I guess it should be filled with grease, but on mine after 40 years, this was just powder and the plunger was completely stuck. I was considering referring the unit with new seals, but failing to be able to open it up and then finding these are still available new and only costing £14 from a seller on Ebay, I just bought a new one. These are used on some Citroen cars apparently as well as Fiats.

I have spent the last 3 months therefore removing, cleaning and repainting where necessary the rear suspension. A few still to do and I still have to clean and paint in the wings, especially the top of the turrets which are not too bad, but need some protection before I reassemble the whole thing.

I will post some photos of the parts as I have them now when I get chance to line them up!

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: mangocrazy on January 27, 2020, 11:55:07 AM
Good stuff Peter. Life does unfortunately get in the way of Beta fettling. Glad to hear you're back on the refurb again. Sounds like it's fairly close to completion?


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on January 27, 2020, 12:27:48 PM
Hi Graham

Close!!!!

No chance, still have the full interior to go back in and I have never had the engine running yet.......

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on January 28, 2020, 12:54:30 AM
Here are some photos of the parts removed, cleaned and painted. A few more comments -

As mentioned the rear brake balancer is operated by a lever which you can see at the bottom of the photo with the springs in it. This lever runs through a rubber bush fastened to the bottom of the car. Tnis bush was in perfect condition, just needing a clean from the slight rusting of the bar. The end of the lever which attaches to the anti roll bar has ring into which goes two opposing bushes and has a metal spindle through the bushes. There is an identical ring/bushes/spindle on the part which is fastened to the anti roll bar and the two are connected via two plates with holes in and fastened with bolts. These 4 bushes were totally degraded and pretty much crumbled on removal. They are also found on Fiat 124s and are available from a few sources, I ordered mine from Mark W.

The ends of the anti roll (sway) bar are different on these early Betas in that they attach to the hubs via a ball joint arrangement rather than the bushes found on later cars. The two are not inter changeable either bar or hub. The removal of the ball joint from the anti roll bar was an absolute pig, necessitating the effective destruction of the ball joint. Fortunately I found a couple of NOS ones in Italy at not too silly money, which is a welcome change from a lot of Italian sellers who seem to want a fortune for ‘special’ pieces as I cannot imagine these were used on any other vehicle. The new ball joints can be seen in the photo with the new brake balancer.

As mentioned above I managed to end up with two decent rear callipers. I managed to separate the yoke piece from the main body again with some difficulty. There is a small 4mm pin which in theory you press in, not on these, I ended up drilling them out and have bought some 4mm pins to replace them. After this it was a case of a fair amount of hammer time to separate the yoke from the body as corrosion builds between the cast of the yoke and the alloy of the rest of the calliper. Cleaned up they slide on easily.......

The yoke needs to come off to allow you to remove the main cylinder and hence renew the seals. Also you need to remove the rear screw arrangement which is part of the hand brake assembly. I managed to find a NOS handbrake cable locally which was handy.

The last items I am finishing off are the struts. As per normal on stripping down the metal plates which sit on top of the springs were non existent, just a distant memory with a rust colour on the upper rubber support. The 4 rubber supports wee not in bad condition, though I replaced the worst one with another I had spare. One of the original dampers appeared very stiff so I made up a tool to remove the retaining nut and removed both of the inserts. One appeared ok, the other had very cruddy oil so obviously dirt had been getting in. I bought some time ago a pair of sealed replacement gas inserts, so I am going to paint the strut body inside and out and use them. Handily they come with their own retaining nut which does not require a special tool, just a large spanner.



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on January 29, 2020, 06:22:48 PM
Another couple of photos. First is of the rubber parts of the struts (+ the yokes from the callipers which I missed off the earlier photos). The rubber parts were cleaned and then finished with Autoglym vinyl/rubber restorer which gives a nice finish to parts. I have used it on various of the rubber and vinyl parts in the car and makes a tired old part look cared for. It was especially effective on the rubber matting in the boot which came with the early Spyders.

The second photo is the parts from Mark which had perished/rusted away. two spring support plates, 4 off bushes for the rear brake balancer mechanism and two rear bearing retaining ring. The spring supports fit superbly onto the spring and rubber, I assume they come via the tool which Matt had made many moons ago? Also the rubber bushes are very well shaped (slightly conical) with a small shoulder and again fit perfectly.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 28, 2020, 12:16:46 AM
Hi All

Been a while since I posted and even with lockdown not managing too much time on the car, but doing a bit each week, so will get there eventually.....

Since the last post I have built up and fitted the rear struts. The rear hubs proved to be a learning curve on replacing the bearings. Removing the old bearings was not too difficult, only removing the hub nut as usual was pig. Use of a puller did most of the rest. On removing the bearing it will split into component parts which was not an issue as I was replacing them. The big issue was installing the the new bearing. I initially enlisted my vice to press in the bearing into the hub which was not so easy, but doable in absence of any press. Then came the problem of how to press the hub onto the stub axle. At this point I relented and press go on buying a cheap Chinese 6 ton press from Ebay.....

The side story here is that it arrived pretty promptly and I assembled and tried it out, whereupon the bottle jack failed within 5 seconds.... All very frustrating. After some Googleing, I found that they can get trapped air in the jack and there is a technique to bleed them which involves pumping the jack with the valve open and rotating it as well. Pumping with the valve open, no problem, rotating another story as the bottle jack is held in the 30+ kilo frame by strong springs. This was solved by use of a ratchet strap to allow the jack to be removed, duly pumped and rotated and that solved the problem immediately, a good result.

So back the hub and I soon wished I had bought one of these presses a while ago as it made light work of the hubs and has been put into use for various jobs since. One faux pas was when I reassembled the second hub was to put it onto the stub axle the wrong way round, end result one wrecked bearing prompting buying another....



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on April 28, 2020, 07:56:30 AM
Hi Peter

You are doing well and I have a long way to go to catch up! I agree on getting a press. Not a lot of money for jobs you have o do on Beta and Montecarlos as service work.

Cheers

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 28, 2020, 08:01:50 AM
Hi Eric

Thanks, it has been a long time, 10 years and counting and still a lot to do. A few jobs I am not looking forward to do yet, including the headliner install.

Another post to update to current state to come later today hopefully....

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: mangocrazy on April 28, 2020, 11:53:34 AM
I must admit that I'd really like to find space for a press in my shed/workshop, unfortunately it would have to contend with the Startrite pillar drill I am restoring, the horizontal bandsaw, the compressor, multiple motorcycle stands, a parts washer, a workbench, some racking and two motorbikes all housed in a 3m x 4m space...

How much was the press you bought, Peter, and what are the approximate dimensions? I suspect that buying from China would be cheaper than buying the steel and welding it up yourself.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 28, 2020, 12:19:55 PM

How much was the press you bought, Peter, and what are the approximate dimensions? I suspect that buying from China would be cheaper than buying the steel and welding it up yourself.

I did consider building one, but just buying the steel made it a no brainier. I paid £58 delivered from a supplier in the UK via Ebay, but payment was to a Chinese firm, they obviously have holding stocks here to allow duty paid and quick delivery. Only downside to them is do not expect much support. I complained about the faulty bottle jack and eventually was told to return the unit, which would have made no sense as a replacement bottle jack is only £15, but for me not a problem as the solution was widely shown on YouTube/Google my go to for most domestic repairs such as boilers and washing machines etc.

Dims are 93cm high, 40cm wide and the base feet are 40cm



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: mangocrazy on April 28, 2020, 12:30:33 PM
Excellent - thanks Peter. That is very cheap. I feel a purchase coming on...


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 28, 2020, 12:37:54 PM
The other job I have managed to complete is rebuilding the rear callipers. This was fairly straightforward and included stainless bleed screws as per the front ones. The big issue with them and glossed over in Haynes is reassembly of the hand brake levers. The mechanism as discussed elsewhere is via plunger/screw arrangement with the main lever activating a cam to push the plunger. The plunger has 5 domed washers under it to act as a spring. The problem is these domed washers leave the head of the plunger too high to insert the lever. The solution I found was to ensure the plunger was screwed into the main piston by putting the assembly in the vice and using a 20mm socket to compress the domed washers and allowing a flat bladed screwdriver to screw in the plunger into the piston which needs to be pressed in as much as possible, especially with new pads. Obviously this is simpler without the cast iron yoke being attached to the main calliper body, but I had removed them originally anyway.

So we now have the plunger in as far as it will go, but after releasing the tension on the domed washers the height of the plunger is too high still to allow the main lever to be inserted and the small ‘cam follower’ for want of a better name to be inserted. So this is where the press comes in. I used a small bolt to press on one side of the plunger to allow the follower and the lever to be inserted about halfway onto the plunger. Then to allow the the lever to go all the way I repositioned the bolt onto the domed washers and compressed them enough to allow it to slide. I had used waterproof grease on the lever, follower and plunger beforehand. This allowed the lever to be fully located and the circlip to be added, followed by a good helping of more grease and finally put the rubber hoods on. Final job was installing the yokes which are held in place with a 4mm split pin as I had drilled out the original pin due to being all rusted etc. End result is shown.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 28, 2020, 12:41:10 PM
Excellent - thanks Peter. That is very cheap. I feel a purchase coming on...

This was the guy who supplied mine, so price has gone up a little, but still cheapish

The construction is pretty good and well painted.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/383365894137?ul_noapp=true (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/383365894137?ul_noapp=true)

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: mangocrazy on April 28, 2020, 08:01:50 PM
Thanks for the link, Peter. I also have some rear calipers to reassemble, and am not looking forward to it. But at least you've provided me with further justification for a press...  :D


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 29, 2020, 10:46:00 PM
Just to finish on the press, one thing which watching one of the recent Binky episodes taught me is the benefit of having good sleeving parts. They bought a commercial kit which I see on Ebay retails for around £60/70, but I resorted to using selected sockets from my set and for the bearings using old inner and outer races which worked a treat putting in the new bearings. I found to get the hub onto the stub axle I used two of the inner races to get the clearance I needed.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on April 29, 2020, 10:48:25 PM
Thanks for the link, Peter. I also have some rear calipers to reassemble, and am not looking forward to it. But at least you've provided me with further justification for a press...  :D

Best of luck, I hope you had better luck than me as I ended up cannibalising 4 to get two acceptable ones, main issue was the piston and rusted in bleed screws.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on May 13, 2020, 10:44:11 AM
Another couple of weeks and a few steps forward and then the odd one back.....

I finally finished assembling the rear hubs and refitting together with the new disks and rebuilt callipers. I have new brake hose and am making new hard brake lines throughout the car. Also fitted the brake balancer assembly and the NOS handbrake cable. I cannot finally tighten the rear suspension until I put the wheels on and lower the car to ride height, but not a big job. Will do that when I have finished the brakes lines.

As a break from the rear I took a look at the window winder mechanism which is very stiff. This may be in part to the felt type strip along the top of the door, but also I felt was the mechanism itself. I tried applying spray grease to what I could get at of the mechanism, but had little effect and also had a bit of the dreaded ‘slipping’ of the gear where the handle is, so as I have a few spare winders, decided to take the plunge and split one to see what was going on inside. I think this was good idea as I found the spindle mechanism coated in very sticky old grease and the long spring was pretty dry. The spindle assembly itself is rather curious in that there is no bearing as such, just a spindle and a tight fitting spring. Splitting the winder was simply a case of using a 7mm dril to drill out the 6 riveted retainers. These are also interesting as the rivets are part of one side of the retaining plates. This itself presents a slight problem when reassembling in that there is very little clearance when fitting the mechanism back into the door for any bolts or nuts. The only way I can see to resolve this is to use some 7mm rivet nuts (rivnuts) which have a small flange which should give adequate clearance and use a 5mm bolt and washers on the side where there is plenty of clearance. I have some on order so hopefully will be a good result. Below is a couple of photos of the component parts of the winder mechanism with the exception of the small rubber stopper at one end and the padding around the spindle where it attaches to the door as I need to replace them.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on May 18, 2020, 09:41:15 AM
Something which had been at the back of my mind was the replacement rubber fuel hoses I installed many moons ago. I decided to take them out from the tank and the engine bay and found the ones I used were unbranded R6 spec ones which maybe at the time were current, but given the scare stories about these I decided to go for branded ones with the current R9 spec. I bought Cohline branded from a UK retailer who specialises in fuel systems, so have to assume they will do the job for the foreseeable future.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: HFStuart on May 18, 2020, 01:24:11 PM
I must admit I hadn't thought about that. I'll check mine when it eventually goes back together.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on May 30, 2020, 06:13:29 PM
A bit of progress, the door window winder mechanisms are all cleaned, greased and back together. The rubbing strip attached to the top of the door skin on the outer side was replaced when the bodywork was done and is very tight for the glass at one end of the door. I used a large screwdriver to open the gap, but erred on the side of caution as I did not want to bend anything. The glass now slides better, though not perfect, but is acceptable. Assembly of the mechanism was fairly simple, I used the press and a suitably sized socket to get the spring back into the housing. The idea of using 7mm rivnuts and bolts was only a half success as it is not possible to get washers on the bolt side of the rivnut due to the contours of the mechanism, so I cut down some approx 6mm headed screws to use as a centre to the rivnut and using the press (amazing how often it comes in useful) I pressed the screw head into the rivnut making it like a normal rivet gun rivet. Not pretty but very effective. I have the drivers side one all back and works very smoothly and without too much effort, so a good result in my book. Always amazing how long these things take, probably been 2/3 days on this job alone.....


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on June 01, 2020, 06:03:25 PM
Hi Peter

I feel your pain with the door glass rubbing strips. Mine rolled in on themselves jamming the electric windows which had been flying up and down for a Beta setup. With them removed full speed windows re-instated. I am now prising the old strips out of the stainless trims to replace with strips supplied from Italy by Cicognani. We will see if this is the solution to the too long saga of fitting up the doors. 

Keep going we will get it done in the end.

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 01, 2020, 10:36:36 PM
Thanks Eric. Yes the door strips are on of those things which are a complete pig to replace. My guy when he did the bodywork ‘replaced’ the outer strip and that is a bit too wide really, but as my windows are manual, not as bad as if they had been electric I think. The drivers side one has ended up being somewhat easier to raise than the passenger one, but that is how they are staying.

I bought a stainless exhaust some time ago, used from a coupe. It was in good condition, the only issue was that the down pipe was welded via a flexi to the centrally mounted box which made it pretty unwieldy and very hard to get the outlet of the middle box over the rear frame. So I decided to sacrifice the flexi and grind out the welds which was pretty successful. I have ordered a stainless flexi and my debate now is the exhaust manifold.

I have a couple of 4-2-1 manifolds, one is almost new and off a Strada 130TC, the other I forget its origins, but I seem to remember it was for a beta. I would like to use the Strada one, but I can think of two issues, first the Strada was 2l and mine is a 1600, so block height might be an issue, secondly, the engine angle of the Strada which I cannot find documented anywhere. So anyone ever tried using one of these or know if the angle is different to the Beta?


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: HFStuart on June 02, 2020, 09:20:22 AM
Failing that Peter my old manifold will be available  - the flange it's been re drilled to suit a 2L but it's designed for a 1600 so should work well on yours.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 02, 2020, 06:55:07 PM
Hi Stuart

Thanks for the offer, what is the manifold (4-2-1)?

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: HFStuart on June 02, 2020, 10:26:49 PM
Yes  4-2-1 in stainless. CSC I think. I'll fish it out and get you a photo or two.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 02, 2020, 11:21:41 PM
Thanks again Stuart. I aim to take the original manifold off the car tomorrow and offer up the Strada one and see how it fits or not.

Another small job appeared whilst I was working on the window winders. The car currently has the front wheels up on ramps, and on opening the doors they should stay open curtesy of a door spring, sadly neither do, so I removed the spring assembly and it was obvious they were worn and the gap in the U shaped metal part was too wide. This is spring type steel, so to get the gap reduced I placed the U end in the vice to close up the gap and applied some heat to the bend. This worked a treat as the gap stayed reduce. Be careful if you try this as one of them I over did it and the gap was too small, fortunately I have a spare or two. I then cleaned them up with the wire wheel and a quick coat of paint and they are ready to fit and hopefully the doors will now stay fully open when asked to. Picture shows the two springs and one of the mounts in the door.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on June 03, 2020, 08:23:27 AM
Interesting. Normally it is just the plastic section worn or broken that has the doors flying open.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 03, 2020, 09:08:22 AM
Hi Eric

It may well be the plastic part is worn, but nothing much can be done to change that. The original metal springs appear to have a plastic type of coating/thick painted surface on them originally which was definitely worn away on the ones I have.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: Nigel on June 04, 2020, 10:21:42 AM
Peter, re. the plastic part that fits in the door, i've seen these with a steel roller perhaps from later cars?

I think that,if a roller could be turned, making a fresh unit may be feasable.

Thoughts from a while back.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 04, 2020, 03:06:32 PM
Peter, re. the plastic part that fits in the door, i've seen these with a steel roller perhaps from later cars?

I think that,if a roller could be turned, making a fresh unit may be feasable.

Thoughts from a while back.

Hi Nigel

Would be interesting to see it, though that sounds more expensive than the plastic one, so maybe earlier (would be Series 1 if so as my car is very early S2).

I reassembled and fitted the ones I ‘modified’ above and they work very nicely thank you, so another job ticked off. Long way still to go, but still enjoying it after all this time, even if some jobs present significant frustration.

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 07, 2020, 11:14:58 AM
As I was working on the doors, I thought I would address the plastic covers for the two large holes in the doors which give access to the winder and opening mechanism. I had kept one set of the originals which were not in the best of states, but used them to make up 2 sets of new ones. I used some heavy gauge black PVC which is used in damp coursing that I happened to have and cut out the shapes. One is pretty symmetrical, the larger is not, but is simply a mirror image for either door. After cutting them out the tricky bit is how they attach at the bottom which is via some tabs which appear to be ‘welded’ on the originals. I used a strip of the PVC for these tabs and slit the covers in the same place as original tab and using glue attached the tabs which should be good enough to keep water away from the doorcards which is the covers main job in life. My gluing skills are not too hot, but it did get the job done  as can be seen in the photo below. The green covers are the originals, the black the new ones (one side).


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 07, 2020, 04:08:33 PM
As the covers need to be stuck in place, I am not quite at the point I can install them yet. The last job I need to do is to install the door rearward lights which are located just below the lock. As mine is an early S2 it still has the actual light, not a simple reflector that the later cars do. The circuit is enabled via the door switch. I have not seen many of these lights come up for sale and of the two I had in the car, one was badly stuck together, so took me ages to separate and then clean it. The other was much more accommodating and was simply a case of strip and then clean all the under seal gunk out of it. Photo of the lights are below.

There is one other large hole in the door and that is the hole for the speaker, which I had no intention of using. However the original cover was a simple PVC sheet over the hole which did not seem to be well thought out as it would allow water to collect at the lower edge. As it happened I bought a bunch of spares many years ago now in which came 2 off Wipac speaker pods, new with seals and they with some chopping about fit the holes perfectly and give a decent seal. Not a perfect solution, but good enough and does give me the option of speakers if I so desire. Photo of one of them installed below. I may still have some more cutting to do along the bottom edge as not offered up the door card or lower trim to it yet.

Last job is one I have looked forward to for a very long time. Back in 2010/11 I went through all the seals for the door, bonnet, boot etc and decided what could be reused and what needed replacing. I then visited Woolies and bought what I needed from their range. Not exact matches, but they looked close enough to do the job. I finally managed to start using them today and installed the boot seal which appears to fit perfectly, full result. Must now finish off the trim in the boot now as just need to glue the side covers on.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: Nigel on June 08, 2020, 02:20:27 PM
Peter, re. the plastic part that fits in the door, i've seen these with a steel roller perhaps from later cars?

I think that,if a roller could be turned, making a fresh unit may be feasable.

Thoughts from a while back.

Hi Nigel

Would be interesting to see it, though that sounds more expensive than the plastic one, so maybe earlier (would be Series 1 if so as my car is very early S2).

I reassembled and fitted the ones I ‘modified’ above and they work very nicely thank you, so another job ticked off. Long way still to go, but still enjoying it after all this time, even if some jobs present significant frustration.

Peter

Upon a rummage, I found this. I was mistaken in that the roller is nylon, but the cage is very steel!



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on June 08, 2020, 04:37:38 PM
Hi Nigel

Definitely not seen one of those and may be cheaper to produce than the ones I have hence for later cars? I assume the was some form of cover plate?

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: Nigel on June 08, 2020, 10:55:07 PM
Hi Nigel

Definitely not seen one of those and may be cheaper to produce than the ones I have hence for later cars? I assume the was some form of cover plate?

Peter

I don't recall about a cover plate but quite possible. This is in a box of bits I brought
back from South Africa in 06. No part number or any other markings.I'm now wondering
whether this was an SA reproduction part.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 05, 2020, 11:06:14 PM
Have been doing various jobs on the car, a few still halfway through, like rekeying the locks. Still have the glovebox one to sort out, but my one and only key broke during it, so have ordered a couple from John Richard Security Products, hopefully here this coming week.

One job which I have completed after being at a standstill for a couple of weeks is the front to back brake line. I took the decision to renew all the brake lines and this is the last one I needed. I have a Sykes Pickavant flaring tool which I inherited from my father, so must be well over 30 years old. I have however had issues with the pipe not being held firmly and giving duff flares. It is also a pain to make the flare on the car, so as I only needed one more flare, I bought a cheap EBay tool kit thinking it would do the job (see first photo). If I had read more I would not have wasted my time, this does not work on Copper-Nickel pipe, just Copper which is no use. So I bought the tool in the second photo following glowing reports. This does the job no problem and is real easy to use on the car. Plenty of folk sell them, I bought via Ebay. So in theory I now have all the brakes renewed/refurbished, just need to get the rear wheels on the floor, tighten the rear brake adjuster and try bleeding the brakes. I fully expect some of the flares I have made will need some attention, but that is all part of the game.....



Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 05, 2020, 11:26:14 PM
Slight divert to sort the exhaust. I have decided to leave the standard manifold on the engine for now as I did not relish taking it off, and so assembled the down pipe I had bought a long time ago which incorporates twin flexi sections (see photo). I also bought a used stainless exhaust system from a guy who was parting out his Coupe. This was all welded up apart from the back box, and included an intermediate box, a length of stainless tube to a small flexi section which was finally welded to an original steel down pipe. I took the grinder to it and separated the intermediate box from the pipe extension from the flexi/down pipe. The new stainless down pipe with the twin flexis now mates with the extension pipe, which in et urn mates with the intermediate box all via standard/removable bolt on brackets and exhaust paste is already on the shelf. I also received the new two intermediate box hangers from a guy in Italy and the brackets for the rear exhaust are all painted and ready for the exhaust.

I also dug out the heat shield for the top of the down pipe and gave all the parts a clean and treated them to some heat tolerant paint. Not sure how effective it will be, but they certainly look better than the rusty lot of parts I started with (see second photo)!


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 05, 2020, 11:39:10 PM
I have also started biting the bullet on a job I have been putting off for a while, that is the headlining. The original headlining was well past its best and the trimmer who recovered the chairs etc, supplied me with the material and also sewed together the pieces for the main section which is above your head and down either side near the rear hood. He also supplied some thin foam which has a material mesh backing to put under the headlining material. I have used this foam across the top of the windscreen, but I though it was too thin for the rest of the places where headlining was required. I therefore bought some thicker foam and so far so good. As expected it is taking a long time to get things all installed. My basic idea is to stick the foam to the metal surfaces and then trim to suit. Then attach the headlining using small cutoffs of U shaped trim along the lengths. Some sections require the edge of the headlining to be glued to the edges of the metal. This is for the rubber seals which are for the targa top and the rear hood as they do not provide a strong ‘clip’ effect unlike the trim around the windscreen, door etc. I will post some photos a little later!


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 26, 2020, 05:25:50 PM
Headlining still underway, a bit like painting the Forth road bridge for me as a definite amateur. Not particularly a job I would relish doing again, however it is not coming out too bad in my eyes, others may disagree of course!

In between times have been doing a bunch of small jobs, which mainly include cleaning old grease/crap off parts and putting on some paint where needed to protect from rust. One job I realised I had not even thought of was to clean and check the seat runners. These were pretty caked in grease and fluff, one seat had all 4 rollers, the other only two. There were 7 correct bolts and one self tapper..!  So the hole will will need to be re-tapped. All the fun of the fair. Photo of cleaned up parts ready to go back on. Also dug out all the fixing washers and plates for the seats, these were also pretty grim, so more cleaning and a coat of paint to help protect them. I was considering using stainless bolts to fasten the seats to the floor of the car, but did wonder if the tensile strength of them was significantly different to normal steel bolts, any comments?


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 26, 2020, 05:31:13 PM
I also got the Cif out to the seat belt straps which were pretty mucky, they came up a treat, as did the plastic covers for the mounts and the cleaned and painted the brackets for mounting the main inertia reel.

Lastly I removed the latches from the Targa top and gave them a clean and a tidy up lick of paint, just to the main visible surface as doing the rest would be way too difficult. Hoping to be screwing the retaining brackets, sun visors and mirror onto the roof of the car very soon now I have progressed on the headlining.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on July 26, 2020, 05:41:46 PM
Hi Peter

We are doing the same jobs on slightly different schedules! Use Plated bolts for the seat fixings not stainless as this is an area where a failure will hurt!. These will say 8.8 on the head. I have the headling joy to come once I finish the never ending soundproofing!

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 26, 2020, 06:19:46 PM
Hi Eric

Soundproofing and Spider do not seem to go together. I have some to install over what the bodywork guys did, but doubt it will have a lot of effect, out of interest where are you installing it (everywhere?). Also are you sealing the gaps between the cabin and the boot?

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on July 27, 2020, 08:34:33 AM
Hi Peter

Montecarlo experience comes into play because they are famously noisy. On mine I can now hear the stereo nicely on the move despite having a louder than standard engine! Noise is Vibration and the sources are: engine, exhaust, road. So I am using the best stick on resonance absorber Dynamat over the floor arches in the cabin and firewall. I will also add it to the doors in the sunken panel areas and to the roof in central panel spots. The boot floor has Fat Mat fitted which is cheaper but inferior. I also have to add Tiger seal spots on the boot and bonnet frames to skins and will probably add shaped dynamat triangles so they do not ring with a tap. A nice dead thunk is what you want. The Bonnet will have Mark's liner for cosmetic reasons and some sound proofing even though it has an inferior felt backing.

I am not adding lead sheet as suggested by some. Modern Manufacturers are not either!

Old images say the boots had sound proofing on the strut towers arches & inner rear wings with incredibly water holding felt on top in the corners. I will copy the factory with closed cell foam not felt! I will try to keep boot capacity and carpet fitting little changed.   

The Targa will have 4mm foam under a new acoustic cloth liner. I have various Dynamat closed cell foam with barrier skin options for over the dynamat and really wish I had kept the rotting OE Felt and tar stuff for a pattern! I will pattern it with bubble wrap because I have it.

I will put anti resonance on the panel behind the rear seats but it is lower priority.     

If a ring from a tap changes to a dead sound you are winning, but it is the dullest and slowest job ever and suited to child labour if it did not involve sharp knives and scissors!

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 27, 2020, 09:06:35 AM
Wow, that is pretty exhaustive and I will not be going anywhere near that level. Good tip on the ting/thunk, I shall have an experiment. I too have a bonnet blanket from Mark, via Neil to fit.

On the cabin to boot are you sealing up the many open points, if so what with?

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on July 27, 2020, 03:41:50 PM
Hi Peter

No I am not sealing up the panel to the boot. If I have the sound proofing right on the external surfaces it is a waste of effort IMHO.

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 27, 2020, 03:58:11 PM
Hi Eric

Ok, I understand, will get on with the ting testing before I start on the door cards etc!

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 27, 2020, 04:28:32 PM
As an aside today and having to stay off my feet today due to a rope burn from a dog lead on my lower leg (who would have dogs...) I decided to have a go at yet another new skill.

On these early Spiders (according to the parts book) there is a small leather strap to keep the hood latches closed. They fit onto the upper hoop of the hood frame either side of the two latches. They were only installed on the first few hundred cars on Series 2. The ones on mine were there, but in need of replacing. Essentially a piece of leather or leatherette with a stitching and a custom buckle one end and a self tapper with cup the other. I do not possess a sewing machine so it was either ask someone to do the stitching or use a sewing tool which I bought a while ago. Always nice to have a go yourself, so that was the plan. I bought a strip of black leather from Ebay and using the old piece I cut two pieces, glued them together and marked out the hole positions and then spent a few hours stitching. The photo shows the result with the old studs attached (not brilliant, but passable) the stud which goes into the frame, the old strap and the sewing needle used. This type of hand sewing needle is good for small repairs to any areas such as seats etc. And you can attach varying sizes of needle. I just have to make a second one now.....


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on July 29, 2020, 04:28:57 PM
Hi Peter

Use Plated bolts for the seat fixings not stainless as this is an area where a failure will hurt!. These will say 8.8 on the head.

Eric
Hi Eric

I am guessing you mean the bolts from the runners to the seats? I will reuse the original bolts for that. I was meaning the bolts to the floor pan, which after recently reading Matt’s how to on refurbishing the runners, I realised they were the Allan headed bolts which are shown below and I have plenty of!

Here is a link to Matt’s how to

https://www.betaboyz.myzen.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=379.0 (https://www.betaboyz.myzen.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=379.0)

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on July 29, 2020, 05:50:06 PM
Hi Peter

I am glad you found the right bolts for the seats. I received the Torneau today. Please can you PM me how much you need for the shipping.

Thank you again

Eric


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on September 02, 2020, 04:59:53 PM
As another aside I took stock of the stainless strips for the edge of the carpet next to the doors and the stainless strips above the sills and at the bottom of the doors. All were in need of a good clean and had a number of scratches. I remembered an old old Wheeler Dealers episode where they were renovating a Frogeye. Mike took the aluminium trim strips to a specialist polisher and the results were amazing. So, decided to look into how to polish stainless and came up with a company who were on Ebay. I gave them a ring and had a sensible conversation ending in buying a kit of three wheels and three polishes. The first is to get the surface scratches out, the next is to start returning to a shine and the final is to give it the normal stainless shine. This arrived promptly and was not expensive at just over £20 delivered. I have started on the carpet strip which was particularly bad with glue, paint and some bitumous adhesive. I first cleaned with Jizer, then rinsed and followed with Cif and finally used a Stanley Blade to remove the stubborn paint overspray. Then set to with the polishing kit. The results are as I had hoped with a nice even shine. Below are a couple of photos, the first is the one of the carpet strips before starting and the other the finished one. Not sure how well they will show the difference in the photos, but in the flesh a great result.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on September 02, 2020, 05:08:21 PM
The company is Metal Finishing Supplies, Cannock. Here is the kit which also includes a mandrel for a drill (not shown). Their card is included in the photo.


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on September 02, 2020, 06:34:10 PM
Nice Work

I cheated and took bits to Pete the Polisher on West Wycombe Road. He does a lot of work for TV name restorations is very local and fairly cheap. Bumpers are more of a problem. I had to get my 2 front IE types done elsewhere and did not like the cost frankly. It would have taken a LONG time with a grinder mop and a lot of space.

Eric 


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on September 02, 2020, 11:28:41 PM
Hi Eric

It helps that I am effectively retired so have more time than a lot of folk and have no target date for finishing the car. I am also enjoying finding out about these little skills and having a go at them. Some of the things I have done will be a bit on the bodge it side, but hopefully will be a decent result in the end.

Just in the middle of unscrambling the various odd wires for the dash. On this version you get wiring for things which do not exist/future use which is quite amusing as well as a switch which does nothing and has nothing attached to it.... Keeps you on your toes!

Peter


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on September 03, 2020, 04:09:28 PM
I have now completed the headlining and fitted the seals around the windscreen, doors, targa roof and rear hood. The headlining took an age as never tried it before, the result is ok, but would not want to have to do many (any?) more of them. I have left the light aperture for after I have tested the electrics as once fitted I do not want to take it out again.....


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: WestonE on September 03, 2020, 06:26:29 PM
Hi Peter Impressive work!

I have this to look forward to and I am dreading it frankly. I have the new headlining sections ready to go, but find myself keenly doing everything else first.

Eric
 


Title: Re: Spyder restoration - long time coming
Post by: peteracs on September 03, 2020, 07:33:39 PM
I can well understand that, I put it off for a while as well. Best of luck and take your time.

Peter